Need insight re macro lenses...

[doctormike]

Hi,

I have a Canon EOS 10D in an Ikelite housing, with a single DS125 strobe. For wide angle work I use a Tokina 12-24. For closeup work, I have two lenses: Canon 100 mm macro and a Canon 50 mm 1.4 (not a macro lens). I find that I use the 50 mm lens more, especially when diving in the northeast, as the longer focal length macro lens is hard to use in current, surge, and darker waters with relatively poor visibility. I have gotten fairly good results with the 50, but I would like to be able to get closer for more macro of smaller subjects. The 100 mm lens puts more of a water column in the shot, so I use it more on shallow Caribbean reefs, etc...

I understand that many people use the Canon 60mm macro for this, which would be great for me, but unfortunately it is an EF-S lens which will not work on the 10D (or any of the full sensor cameras, apparently). The EF-S series will only work on 20D and above.

SO, should I:

1) upgrade my system to a 20D (new housing and camera body, probably around $1000 used) so that I can use the Canon 60mm macro?

2) try the Canon 50 mm f2.5 "compact macro" and save the money (maybe to buy another strobe!)...?

3) try the Sigma 50mm f2.8 macro (which I think will work with my system)?

4) Just stick with what I have?

Thanks to anyone who wants to throw some insight my way...!

Mike

 

[newmanl]

Hi Mike,

It certainly sounds like you've done your homework in terms of options, so I may not be very helpful here - but I'll offer what I can.

A colleague of mine shoots a 20D and the EF-S 60 macro, but recently bought a Canon compact 50 macro for back up. Apparently it shoots as well as the 60, but with slightly closer working distances. Unfortunately, I have no personal experience with it, or the Sigma 50.

As for the upgrade, I'm not sure I would until I had to - as you know, even a "new" rig is not cheap.

Lastly, I shoot with the 100 macro and while it can put a bunch more water inbetween you and the subject, I have not found it limiting at all. Here's a shot from the dark green waters of the Pacific Northwest with the 100 macro and a single Ikelite DS-160:

My two-bits would be to go for the Canon compact 50 macro or just get used to to the 100 - I like the 100... a lot.

Here's another with the 100 and single strobe:

Hope at least some of this helps and good luck with your decision.

Lee

 

[doctormike]

Hi Mike,

It certainly sounds like you've done your homework in terms of options, so I may not be very helpful here - but I'll offer what I can.

Wow, beautiful shots and very helpful advice! I think that I agree with you...

I can get the compact macro for less than $300 and see if that does what I need. I might get the shorter port, since right now I am using the long port for the 100 mm lens with the 50 mm 1.4 - not a close focus issue with this non-macro lens, since the minimum focus distance is beyond the end of the port, but with the 50mm macro, I would be "wasting" the close focus.

I guess I can also spend some time working with the 100 mm lens as well... I just need to be in a fairly low surge/current situation. I love that lens for the rubble pile in front of Eden beach in Bonaire, though! I just take some extra weight and sit still on the bottom... One limitation is that I'm less flexible - if I see anything that is not tiny, it's unlikely that I will be able to pull back enough to get a good shot with the 100, but with a macro 50, I could always get enough space to do a reasonable "fish portrait"....

I just dove Puget Sound and the San Juans for the first time this spring (I'm from NYC), had a GREAT time..! Looking forward to going back. Here are a couple that I took with the 50 mm f1.4:

 

[bvanant]

The other option, that i think is better is to get the EFS 60 and use the Canon 12 mm extension tube. Outstanding results and this 60 is a far better lens than the 50 macro, faster focusing etc. The other option is to take a look at the new Tamron 60 macro which will work on the 10D and has wonderful IQ'
Bill

 

[ptyx]

[-]I'm enjoying the 20D/60mm macro combo (Ikelite housing as well) - but I would be hesitant to 'upgrade' from the 10D to the 20D because of the sensor size.

Smaller sensor means smaller/darker viewfinder, and although it's not much of an issue on land it is quite annoying underwater.

Also remember that although the working distance won't be impacted, the view angle will, and the 60mm EF-S macro behaves like a 90mm in term of 'how big a critter you can shoot'.[/-]
^^ above info is incorrect, as it turns out 10D has a cropped sensor as well

I'm always reluctant to go out with the 60mm in CA waters as I know I'll miss dozens of good opportunities - because the subjects are to big!

 

[doctormike]

The other option, that i think is better is to get the EFS 60 and use the Canon 12 mm extension tube. Outstanding results and this 60 is a far better lens than the 50 macro, faster focusing etc. The other option is to take a look at the new Tamron 60 macro which will work on the 10D and has wonderful IQ'
Bill

The Tamron looks good! Are you sure that it will work on the 10D? I guess only the EF-S lenses don't, so this should be OK...

 

[doctormike]

I'm enjoying the 20D/60mm macro combo (Ikelite housing as well) - but I would be hesitant to 'upgrade' from the 10D to the 20D because of the sensor size.

Don't the 10D and 20D have the same size sensor?

Smaller sensor means smaller/darker viewfinder, and although it's not much of an issue on land it is quite annoying underwater.

Does the sensor affect the view through the finder in a DSLR?

Also remember that although the working distance won't be impacted, the view angle will, and the 60mm EF-S macro behaves like a 90mm in term of 'how big a critter you can shoot'.

I'm always reluctant to go out with the 60mm in CA waters as I know I'll miss dozens of good opportunities - because the subjects are to big!

Thanks!

 

[ptyx]

Don't the 10D and 20D have the same size sensor?

I thought the 10D was full frame, but you're right - forget all I've said!

Does the sensor affect the view through the finder in a DSLR?

Yes, full frame sensors have larger and brighter viewfinders (at least for the Canon cameras I know).

 

[bvanant]

There are two issues here. The first is the field of view of the lens. The Tamron 60 is designed for APS sensors so it will work fine for the 10D but vignettes a little bit on the 5D (full frame). The second issue is the lens mount. All of the digital rebels and the APS sensor cameras after the 10D use the EF-S lens mount. The 10D uses the EF mount that is on all of the EOS film cameras and the new full frame cameras. The EF-s lenses will not physically work with the EF mount since there is a chunk of glass on the camera side that will hit the mirror box.
The Tamron 60 though works with the 10D since it fits the EF mount perfectly. Fits my 5D and works well with a bit of vignetting.

BVA

 

[doctormike]

There are two issues here. The first is the field of view of the lens. The Tamron 60 is designed for APS sensors so it will work fine for the 10D but vignettes a little bit on the 5D (full frame). The second issue is the lens mount. All of the digital rebels and the APS sensor cameras after the 10D use the EF-S lens mount. The 10D uses the EF mount that is on all of the EOS film cameras and the new full frame cameras. The EF-s lenses will not physically work with the EF mount since there is a chunk of glass on the camera side that will hit the mirror box.
The Tamron 60 though works with the 10D since it fits the EF mount perfectly. Fits my 5D and works well with a bit of vignetting.

BVA

I had actually ordered the 50 mm compact macro, but then thanks to this discussion, began looking into the Tamron 60. Looks like a great lens, and will be an actual macro (1:1) as well as very fast (f2). Will even be a nice choice for some topside portrait work from what I read (although I still love my Canon L series 85 f1.2!).

SO, I was able to stop the order (thanks, Calumet, you rock!), and I'm going to go to B&H next week and try them both out side by side...

Thanks again for all your help, my friends...!



Mike