My scuba class today

[scubaboy1444]

Today was my first day in my scuba class. But I am confused. Half of us had padi materieal, the other half ISS. Why would my class do 2 different kinds if we are all in the same class? The instructor said it is the same material. I am just confused as to why 2 different kinds in the same class. I prefer Padi myself, which I got.

 

[Lopez116]

You mean SSI not ISS. The standards are slightly different, but not much. IMO the instructor makes a much greater difference than the agency standards. I don't know why he'd be teaching both materials at once, though...

 

[DENLASCUBA]

First what course did you enroll in PADI or SSI? What course did the other students enroll in?

Some instructors who are certified for both will briefly reference one agency while teaching another on a few topics, I know a few tech instructors who do this but do not hand out materials from another agency when they are certifying the divers for a specific one (this is another world of training though). If you enrolled in PADI you are required to have a PADI manual and taught per that manual, the instructor can make a reference but if he starts combining the two together leaving out items in the PADI manuals or not following the PADI standards he is no longer teaching a PADI course and instead teaching John Does course; this also applies for the pool and open water sessions. Yes PADI and SSI are basically the same course they also have a few different standards and course outlines and the instructor if teaching PADI must follow PADIs standards and guidelines so he would not be able to teach both classes in the pool/ open water at the same time and would be in violation of not following these standards.

So first find out what agency you will be certified under and then go from there. If you prefer one over the other explain that to the instructor as you are the one paying for the course and he should be following the agencies standards set forth as these are created for a reason.

 

[scubadiver888]

I worked at a shop which did SSI and PADI certifications. They started off as a PADI shop but the shop owner decided she liked some of the advanced certifications SSI offered at that time (this was before PADI TecRec). However most people wanted PADI certifications because they were worried some vacation locations might not recognize SSI certifications. Typically students would come to the shop and ask for PADI certification or when offered SSI certification they ask if they could get PADI certification instead. Occasionally a student would accept SSI certification (usually the student interested in local diving and definitely going on to more advanced certifications).

In her case she ran two classes. Rather than running a joint PADI/SSI class she would run an SSI class and a PADI class. I guess, because she was trained to be a PADI or SSI instructor, she could have done a joint class. For the basic courses most people would do there isn't much difference between PADI and SSI. I think today more and more PADI classes would give the instructor the leeway to teach the same things they would teach as an SSI instructor. Maybe this is why your class was a joint PADI/SSI class.

 

[oly5050user]

if teaching a PADI course then all materials must be PADI..from presentation guides, confined to DVD to text book. water / open wter slates etc..to mix in a class would be confusing to students (as the op has noticed) and make it difficult for the instructor to swich from one to the other. There are knowledge reviews and quiz to be completed for each module in PADI courses that have to be done. I have not taught a SSI course in decades, but if SSI has same requirements of the student owning proper materials, how is the instructor to be able to do this in a limited time frame and meet standards of the agencies? If students are getting a PADI certification and they have SSI materials , how are they going to understand or follow material presented in class or do knowledge reviews/quiz/final exam? This would all be in violation of PADI standards and should be addressed properly.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

Hmm, if the material content itself is the same as far as learning safe diving practices, theory, principles, physics, physiology, etc. Why would the answers on the exams be different or confusing? Boyle's law is Boyle's law if the instructor communicates it effectively and the student understands it. So what if the wording is a little different. Physics is physics to one who knows it. Being confused is a sign of not understanding it or just parroting back answers.
Both of the OW courses I offer allow me to use ANY materials I see fit to get the knowledge across. There are recommended texts. But I can get SEI's OW class done using Graver's 2nd, 3rd, or 4th editions. Just need to switch the workbooks for each edition. Or use the custom workbooks I create that they not only allow but will print for me at no extra cost as long as I provide the word files.
SDI allows me to do the same and supplement the OW diver manual with other texts and supplements.
It's why my own book is now a part of the OW student materials each student gets.

As long as the student is using one agency's materials and the content is covered what makes the difference in terms of knowledge and understanding? Other than the loss of revenue to one agency when the others is used in the same class. Half the class has SSI, half the class PADI? Who cares? Makes no difference when they go to dive later as the most important card they need is MasterCard, VISA, Discover, AMEX, or good old folding cards with pics of dead presidents on them.

 

[Wookie]

I sure wouldn't want to answer in court as to why I was teaching the same level of class from 2 different agencies using one set of words. I'm not an instructor for either agency, but when I became a PADI instructor, you learned specifically what key words and tricky phrases to use to meet PADI standards, and I'd bet that SSI uses slightly different key words and tricky phrases. The instructor is going to be out of standards with one or the other, I'd bet.

 

[RJP]

Hmm, if the material content itself is the same as far as learning safe diving practices, theory, principles, physics, physiology, etc. Why would the answers on the exams be different or confusing?

Per PADI, a student needs to take/pass the PADI exam and quizzes to receive a PADI cert. Similarly per SSI, a student needs to take/pass the SSI exam and quizzes to receive an SSI certification. Yes, the information/material contained in any given question should be the same. However, since the two exams are different... the answers will be different. For example, the answer to your Question #2 might be "B.) 3000psi" while the answer to my Question 2 might be "A.) Exposure Protection."

Even if it were possible to run a SINGLE CLASS that actually meets the standards and performance requirements for BOTH AGENCIES doing so would be woefully inefficient and frustrating for instructor and students alike. Administering and organizing two sets of paperwork, giving/reviewing/remediating two different sets of exams, referring to two different sets of material, highlight the "code words" embedded in each agency's material as Frank points out above. And, while I'm not intimately familiar with SSI, I'm going to guess that there are enough differences (however minor they might be) in the specific conduct and performance requirements for OW and CW dives that it would be virtually impossible for an instructor to run them concurrently without violating the standards of either or both agencies.

---------- Post added January 4th, 2015 at 02:29 PM ----------

It's [-]why[/-] how I can justify including my own book as a part of the OW student materials each student gets.

Clarified that for you.

:d

But seriously, are you at all concerned with the potential liability exposure associated with using a book you wrote and self-published as source material for a class you teach? Would be different if you were the author of the standard SEI materials or you were referring to a chapter that you authored in an industry-accepted text that was not self-published, or wrote an article that was published in a credible/refereed journal. But I'd hate to have to explain to a court/jury that I - and I alone - was using a book that I wrote and published as the basis for what I taught.

 

[Subcooled]

I have taken a course where I was presented with the chance to choose between CMAS and NAUI certification, or both (for the collector) and on one course I could choose between an EFR and a DAN book and certification. This requires a skilled and knowledgeable teacher though, and not someone who is barely able to follow a course manual.

You have a great opportunity to compare PADI books to SSI books.
Enjoy your class and ask whenever in doubt

 

[RJP]

You have a great opportunity to compare PADI books to SSI books and to ask about the differences between the companies

And - if the OP wants it - he will likely also have a chance to compare differences in how each agency responds to student-raised QA inquiries.

:cool2: