Modern research/thoughts on Ascent Rates

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boriss

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Disclaimer: this is meant as a thought exercise for technical divers only. Please do not apply any of these concepts to recreational dives or a dive <40m (~130ft). Stick to recommendations set forth by your training agency and computer.

My goal of this post is to:
1. Compile anecdotal information from people who regularly dive to >50m (~165ft)
2. Gather any scientific information/data/papers to help with what proper guidance should be for technical divers
3. Learn!! Is my math/logic even sound? Did I miss an important variable? Other factors? Etc.

I've been doing some searching and much of the data/papers are pretty old and inconclusive. However, the US Navy dive tables did change the ascent rate from 20m/min to 10m/min in 1993. In either case, the recommendation seems to be oversimplified and if followed at significant depths, would increase inert gas saturation (and thus deco times). The idea is that if one goes deep they'll want to get out "as fast as possible." But how do we quantify how fast? What is fast and what is safe?

There's a lot of tribal knowledge that ascending from depth the magical 10m/min barrier can be broken. The deeper one is, the faster they can ascend. The thought behind that is that the effect of depth/pressure to gas volume is logarithmic. The difference in volume (or the effect of pressure) is smaller the deeper one goes and so the probability of spontaneous bubble formation is reduced. I've created the following graph (blue line) to illustrate this. Note the linearity of the curve below 50m/165ft.

1660310709248.png


Here's the raw data:
The red line represents a calculated ascent rate based on the generic 10m/min (30ft/min) recommendation, relative to air volume. It's meant to be a ratio of air volume at different depths. The exact numbers, nor the intersection between recommendation and depth, isn't the important part here, as I don't expect people to follow this approach. The important thing to note is how quickly (mathematically) we may be able to ascend from depth. Even if we change the math to be a lot more conservative, it's obvious that the rate at which we can move through the water column at depth is incredibly high. This is important as it has a huge impact on further tissue loading and deco obligations.

It's also important to note that there are many variables not taken into account here. For example, I would think a deep dive on air (not recommended) couldn't follow the same logic. I'm making the assumption that this is a trimix dive with an equivalent narcotic depth (END) of a shallower recreational dive. Otherwise, even though the formulas above may "work" the nitrogen loading at depth and subsequently the formation of bubbles would present a great risk with fast pressure changes. We still don't know that 10m/min is a correct recommendation for every depth (rec level dive).

This is probably a lot to digest, thoughts, so far?
 
I think you are missing that deco stops are the primary method for adjusting ascent rate over a given pressure gradient. Include the stops and you will find a very different curve.
 
In an ideal world, ascent rates would be faster at greater depths and decrease as you get shallower. This is reflected in the US Navy Saturation Decompression Table which uses continuous ascent without stops:

1660317177192.png


Of course sat decompression is driven by the slowest tissues and does not have the same urgency to complete in a minimum amount of time like a diver in the water.

It would be possible for dive computers to indicate varying ascent rates but it is debatable if the gain would justify the added complexity and exceed the tolerance inherent in a "one algorithm fits all" model.

Ultimately, decompression will be guided by bubble formation or biomarkers rather than pressure and time.
 
3. Learn!! Is my math/logic even sound? Did I miss an important variable? Other factors? Etc.

I believe you can download Dr Bühlmann's decompression algorithms, which would presumably allow you to vary ascent rates in the model. This link might help you find them.

Anyone interested in Dr Albert Bühlmann would be interested in his early work for Hannes Keller. This was really black magic in the early 1960s.

 
I think you are missing that deco stops are the primary method for adjusting ascent rate over a given pressure gradient. Include the stops and you will find a very different curve.

This is an academic discussion to get an understanding. If there's a ceiling, then we can't blow past that ceiling, but the question is how fast can we get to it?

For example, if you plan a 150m/500ft dive for 20-minutes, your first stop will be in the 75-100m (240-320ft) range. How fast can you get to that stop? If moving at 10m/min that's a 5-8-minute ascent, while you're picking up more deco obligation. If I go based on the calculation above, I'm suggesting it can be done in 1-2 minutes (say using a scooter, not uncontrollably just floating up quickly).

@Akimbo thank you! I understand the argument for simplicity, but I'm still curious what the relative limits should be. I wonder if it's safe to extrapolate those saturation table limits? They seem a lot more conservative, but then again, they have the time.

I'll read the rest of your links, thanks! :)
 
For example, if you plan a 150m/500ft dive for 20-minutes, your first stop will be in the 75-100m (240-320ft) range. How fast can you get to that stop?

Wouldn't the calculated stop depth depend on the rate of ascent you input?
 
Disclaimer: this is meant as a thought exercise for technical divers only. Please do not apply any of these concepts to recreational dives or a dive <40m (~130ft). Stick to recommendations set forth by your training agency and computer.

My goal of this post is to:
1. Compile anecdotal information from people who regularly dive to >50m (~165ft)
I am having trouble reconciling these statements. If you only follow certification recommendations, then how do you gather anecdotal information which is outside of that?
 
I wonder if it's safe to extrapolate those saturation table limits?

I would say it is an indicator but extrapolating would be a gross over simplification. Your premise reflects this basic conundrum:

It is very common for slower tissues to still be ingassing during a decompression stop while faster tissues are outgassing. It all has to be calculated to limit bubble formation to prevent blocking your bloodstream.
 
As this is a thought experiment, and assuming the RELATIVE rate of change of absolute pressure is the important part (R = Pdot/P), a reference pressure rate of 1 atm/min (33 fsw/min), and a reference pressure of 33 fsw (2 atm), the critical ratio to not exceed is 0.5. Solving for Pdot and converting to a depth rate:
Ascent Rate = 0.5 (D + 33) ft/min​
Thus, at 33 ft, we see the reference rate of 33 ft/min. At the surface, we see a rate of 15 ft/min. More to your question, at a depth of 500 ft, the rate would be 266 ft/min.

ETA: as I recall, @Superlyte27 has experience doing such ascents.
 
This is an academic discussion to get an understanding. If there's a ceiling, then we can't blow past that ceiling, but the question is how fast can we get to it?
You are making an artificial distinction between ascent rates and deco stops.

A ceiling is the depth at which your most loaded tissue hits your desired maximum supersaturation, whether it's Haldane's 2.0 or some lesser percentage of that. This depth is never static until it equals 0. In theory, the fastest total ascent time would come from a continuous ascent that rides the supersaturation limit. Since calculating that on the fly was impossible until fairly recently, the concept of stops at regular intervals was introduced to simplify calculation and to decrease the number and severity of gross ascent rate errors. One byproduct of this is that deco stops are only coincidentally set at actual ceilings.

For example, if you plan a 150m/500ft dive for 20-minutes, your first stop will be in the 75-100m (240-320ft) range. How fast can you get to that stop? If moving at 10m/min that's a 5-8-minute ascent, while you're picking up more deco obligation. If I go based on the calculation above, I'm suggesting it can be done in 1-2 minutes (say using a scooter, not uncontrollably just floating up quickly).
Assuming the RELATIVE rate of change of absolute pressure is the important part (R = Pdot/P), a reference pressure rate of 33 ft/min, and a reference pressure of 33 ft (2 atm), the critical ratio to not exceed is 0.5. Solving for Pdot and converting to a depth rate:
Ascent Rate = 0.5 (D + 33) ft/min
Thus, at 33 ft, we see the reference rate of 33 ft/min. At the surface, we see a rate of 15 ft/min. More to your question, at a depth of 500 ft, the rate would be 266 ft/min.
Human physiology puts a practical limit on ascent rates due to our intermittent and non-instantaneous method of gas exchange, i.e. breathing. As DAN puts it in Ascent Rates - Divers Alert Network

"Decompression stress is defined as the amount of inert gas dissolved in various tissues throughout the body. During ascent, bubbles increase in size and are released by tissues into the veins. These venous bubbles then travel to the lungs, where they are offgassed through normal breathing. Faster ascent rates are thought to have an impact on decompression stress by not allowing sufficient gas bubbles to be offgassed through breathing."
 
http://cavediveflorida.com/Rum_House.htm

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