Miflex XT Hoses

[kelemvor]

What do you guys think of the newer "Miflex XT" hoses? They're supposed to provide the flexibility of a braided hose, with negative buoyancy and a smooth surface. I'm not sure if it solves the problem where the interior crystallizes and breaks apart after 5 or so years.
Regulator Miflex XT-Tech Hose

• Similar characteristics of traditional rubber hose yet benefits of a braided flex hose
• Smooth polyurethane outer surface reduces abrasion
• Braided layer includes Kevlar® yarn reinforcement
• Negative buoyancy - Lighter in weight than traditional rubber hoses
• Fittings are marine grade nickel plated brass

I use miflex hoses on my single tank rec diving setup. My miflex hoses are almost 5 years old now so I'm replacing them with these. I'm curious what opinions are from folks who have checked them out. I guess they're too new for any to have degraded and broken apart inside, so I'll bet nobody knows for sure if they're susceptible to that problem but it's worth asking just in case.

 

[АлександрД]

First - they make soft and lightweight hoses, to be a soft and light.
but with scratching braiding.
Than divers asked to made it sleek.
Later divers asked to made it heavy.

What next? To make it hard?
In conclusion - we need to have hoses, same as rubber, but not from rubber? (but soft, if possible)

One our rebreather diver has manufacture of their own hoses Making your own hoses - it VERY soft.

Also is very usable old soviet (and modern garden) hoses Braided Hoses, Like Sandpaper?

I think in the future we will have the best hoses with inner silicone tube, and outer braiding from very slick and soft matherial, like Dyneema braiding - it should be the best solution - heavy, very soft and slick and very strong against damages.
There could be just connector problems, it will require to design very special construction...

So, I think Miflex XT is good, but useless, because it should be more expencive, than rubber, but near the same, just against flexibility.
And under the pressure flexibility of rubber and Miflex should became more equal.

P.S. I use same as Miflex XT hoses for my water pipes at my home

 

[taimen]

What do you guys think of the newer "Miflex XT" hoses? They're supposed to provide the flexibility of a braided hose, with negative buoyancy and a smooth surface.

I have one as my primary longhose. Does what it promises. Properties are quite close to a traditional rubber hose, so you kind of get the advantages of a rubber hose with 3x price... It is a lot lighter and slightly more flexible than a rubber hose.
Personally I like the Miflex XT as primary longhose, traditional Miflex as secondary and stage regulator hoses and traditional Miflex inflator and HP hoses.

I'm not sure if it solves the problem where the interior crystallizes and breaks apart after 5 or so years.

Original Miflex hoses manufactured by Miflex in Italy shouldn't have had this problem since 2009 or maybe 2010.

 

[kelemvor]

I hadn't thought of them being as stiff as a regular hose. Also, personally, I never had a problem with the feel of regular miflex - even with a long hose around my neck. I guess I was just trying the new thing - I hope it won't be a mistake .

Original Miflex hoses manufactured by Miflex in Italy shouldn't have had this problem since 2009 or maybe 2010.

Do you know of any articles or press releases about that? I only learned of the problem when DAN published an article in early 2017. The article certainly didn't mention that it had been fixed. The article states that Dan talked to manufacturers, and the manufacturers described how to identify the problem but didn't say that it had been eliminated.

I wonder if you're thinking of the defective miflex HP hoses that were later fixed?

 

[taimen]

Do you know of any articles or press releases about that? I only learned of the problem when DAN published an article in early 2017. The article certainly didn't mention that it had been fixed. The article states that Dan talked to manufacturers, and the manufacturers described how to identify the problem but didn't say that it had been eliminated.

Yes,
Alert Diver | Air Hoses: A Closer Look

"He subjected a variety of hoses to accelerated aging, and the preliminary finding was that hoses with a thermoplastic polyester-polyurethane (polyester-TPU) lining material decayed during testing. This result is consistent with the hose-failure reports DAN has collected. Hoses made of or lined with thermoplastic polyether-polyurethane (polyether-TPU), on the other hand, did not fail. A well-known European producer of braided hoses, which has always used polyether-TPU, since 2008 has required its materials supplier to certify its polyether-TPU hose linings."

DAN does not endorse any manufacturer, thus this is not exactly clearly stated. But the problem has been identified and "a well known european manufacturer" has actually always used verified polyether-TPU linings.

Miflex has also released it's statement via its resellers.

Dirzone

"
Official Miflex Statement:

Following the latest DAN article regarding crystallization of scuba diving hoses, we would like to confirm that Miflex has always used Polyether based TPU material for their Xtreme scuba diving LP hoses.

We confirm that we have been working together with DAN to make the divers aware of the potential risks they can encounter when they use hoses made with wrong material and we have also agreed with them on the way and frequency to inspect and service the hoses.

We are committed to supply the best possible products on the market and we are proud to stand by our products by laser marking every single LP hose with our brand and the relevant information needed for us to have traceability and confirmation that the hoses are made by Miflex.

We are the only manufacturer who performs a pressure leak test on every single hose that we produce on our automatic assembly lines.

We can also confirm that we have not received any complaint of degrading hoses, for hoses with Miflex name laser marked on the ferrules, operation that we do on all our hoses since year 2009.

We thank you for your support to the Miflex brand of scuba diving hoses."

 

[taimen]

I wonder if you're thinking of the defective miflex HP hoses that were later fixed?

No, see above. I guess part of this confusion is that many divers use term "miflex" for all braided hoses, while this recent issue with regulator LP hoses hasn't really effected original Miflex hoses at all.

 

[Anthony A.]

So other than miflex, anyone made a list of which manufacturers use the polyether TPU?

 

[kelemvor]

I got the hoses in the mail today. They come with an instruction book that answers the question about longevity. I'll take a photo and share the English part. In short, the instructions specifically say the hoses should be replaced after 5 years or 500 dives. That makes the discussion about whether miflex branded hoses are better than generics in this regard or not completely irrelevant.

I was also surprised to see that it specifically says the hoses are not suitable for o2 concentrations over 40%. I guess I'll take that miflex hose off my deco bottle!

The red circles were added by me. The third one pretty much tells me these aren't suitable for cave diving at all. Unless it hasn't been wet yet, cave gear is going to be scuffed to heck and back. Actually, I'd say that means Miflex-XT Tech hoses not suitable for any kind of technical diving at all. What a disappointment. I think regular Miflex-XT may be still okay, since scuffing a hose without the "rubber" exterior would be far more difficult.



I think I'll continue to use miflex for recreational diving.


...and.. LOL! An instruction book for a hose? I got a chuckle about that. Given the fragility of Miflex-XT Tech hoses, it must have been necessary.

 

[kelemvor]

A little about the hose its-self.

I would describe it as being somewhere in between a normal rubber hose and a normal miflex braided hose.
It's more flexible than rubber.
It's less flexible than braided.
The exterior is smoother than braided or rubber hose
The hose diameter is smaller than rubber hose.
the hose diameter is slightly larger than braided hose.

It does "hold on to" bends as the manual suggests. Unfortunately, miflex ships the things in a small plastic bag (as they always have). That means you can't really straighten the thing out completely like you can with a regular hose.

Another complaint about the manual:

Fitting hoses requires specialized knowledge, tools and experience. General mechanical aptitude or every day tools may not be sufficient to properly fit your hose, and could damage your equipment and fittings. Hoses should only be changed and fitted by a properly trained and qualified technician, who can be found at your local dive store and/or service centre.

(yes, the mis-spelling of center was their mistake rather than mine)
What a load of complete crap. Someone should go slap the guys over at miflex. If you're a certified diver and you can't swap a hose, you should reconsider diving.

 

[EireDiver606]

Why complicate something so simple? Pay twice the price for a fancy hose that doesn’t have any real advantages that will alter your diving?
Different strokes for different folks.