Medical Release Issues When Abroad

[though13]

Hello,

Just wanted to post about a recent experience I had in hopes it can help other divers (especially new divers) avoid the issues my husband and I encountered.

We were on a cruise recently (April 2019), and had booked an excursion for a Discover Scuba Dive in Aruba. We are already working on obtaining our Open Water cert through PADI, but this cruise was after our pool/class, and before our 4 checkout dives (on a cruise, we were not in any single port long enough to just do the checkouts in warm water). Because we are already involved with getting certified, we were aware of the medical questionnaire that we would need to fill out, and already have a doctor's signature on the RSTC medical release. I brought copies of our forms for the DSD excursion so we would be prepared.

When we arrived in port in Aruba and went to check in for our dive, we were asked to complete the questionnaire and/or produce our medical release form. I presented our signed forms, and we were rejected. The agent explained that there was no "official seal" on the form, and that we could have just forged our doctors' signatures. I advised her that our doctors had no formal seal or anything like that, and that if we were going to lie, we would have just said that none of the conditions apply. I further advised her that the form we were presenting her was the same form our Local Dive Shop accepted for enrollment of our Open Water course. She retorted "well then your dive shop is not following PADI standards." In the end, we were refused and could not take part in the DSD.

Naturally, we were quite upset with this outcome. I contacted our local PADI office to determine if our LDS was in fact not following some sort of protocol, or if the Dive Op in Aruba misunderstood something, or what was going on, as I want to avoid this in the future. The official response from PADI is below (first comment on this thread), but the synopsis is that each country has different customs and regulations. I received no final answer on if the dive op in Aruba was acting appropriately or not, but PADI indicated it is wise to check with any reputable dive shop in a locality to determine local customs/rules before traveling. I am still uncertain how I could have avoided this situation, as our doctors have no "seal" that they could have put on the release. Nonetheless, I will definitely be researching as much as possible before diving on a cruise excursion again!

Hopefully this (and the PADI reply below) is useful info to you!

 

[though13]

OFFICIAL PADI REPLY:

Hi,

That is an unfortunate experience regarding the medical questionnaire.

It is an international form and is not proprietary to PADI, if you notice it is an RSTC form ( World Recreational Scuba Training Council ) which most of the certifying organizations use worldwide.

All of the international minimum standards are set by the WRSTC with the caveat of which local laws and regulations supersedes standards/recommendations.

Australia is another country which has unique regulations regarding medical.

Moving on it would prudent to check ahead and see what the local customs, laws and regulations are regarding scuba diving medical releases.

You may check with a local dive center using PADI's web site: Professional Association of Diving Instructors | PADI utilizing: Find a Dive Center Dive Shop Locator | Find A Local Dive Shop or Resort | PADI

Liveaboards usually send out a list of required documentation, gear and personal items needed before hand.

Please let me know if you have any additional questions.

Best always,


[name removed]
Training & Sales Consultant

 

[2airishuman]

What a frustrating experience.

This is the sort of thing that gives cruise ship diving a bad name. (If you were on the island for several days of diving, there are all kinds of ways this could have been fixed, by sending them the form in advance so that any questions could be answered days before the dive, or switching to another shop, or visiting a local physician, etc etc)

This is also the sort of thing that leads people to falsify their answers to the questionnaire instead of playing by the rules.

Which dive shop was conducting the DSD?

 

[SandyRobinson]

PADI's answer sounds like BS to me especially since the agent insinuated it was a PADI standard. It would have been interesting to see other forms with a seal. Any chance you missed something in the required documentation from the cruise ship? Of course, it still would not have helped if a doctor does not have a "seal" which I have never heard of.

Was the person an employee of the dive shop/charter or the cruise line? You may consider a report on Trip Advisor so others are not caught as you were.

 

[though13]

@2airishuman I am not sure - I believe it was "Red Sail". My point exactly - I was thinking, "so maybe we should just lie on our forms from now on." Very frustrating to be denied when we were trying to play by the rules and do everything legit.

@carobinsoniv You have never heard of a "seal" or you have never heard of a doctor not having a seal? There was no documentation from the cruise ship which was frustrating. For people who were going to do the DSD and are completely new to diving (which is likely most people doing a DSD) wouldn't have even known to bring a release form! The person was an employee of the dive op. She also called the DM to see if they could accept us without the seal, and he said "no seal, no diving." Very frustrating experience.

 

[Damselfish]

Probably means never heard of a doctor having a seal? I've never heard of it either. If you really got nothing about it from the cruise line - which hopefully did not then charge you for the excursion? - definitely let them know this is going on. Both so they can notify people properly, and maybe so they can have someone who actually knows something about this work with their vendor to do something about it, because it seems bogus. (Or find a different vendor, though I don't know how many options there are in Aruba that could handle cruise traffic.) I agree posting on TripAdvisor is a good idea, and maybe a cruise site would be good - places people likely to run into this situation might read.

Unfortunately there seem to be lots of instances of dive shops/employees anywhere emphatically stating things as fact which are simply not true, for all sorts of reasons.
--
If you poke around on the Red Sail site there is this - http://www.redsailaruba.com/pdf/AR_Medical_Statement.pdf

Which does mention something about a seal, but it could have been updated since April?. Maybe it's an Aruba thing, but they have to know a lot of their customers are from the US.

 

[SandyRobinson]

@carobinsoniv You have never heard of a "seal" or you have never heard of a doctor not having a seal? There was no documentation from the cruise ship which was frustrating. For people who were going to do the DSD and are completely new to diving (which is likely most people doing a DSD) wouldn't have even known to bring a release form! The person was an employee of the dive op. She also called the DM to see if they could accept us without the seal, and he said "no seal, no diving." Very frustrating experience.[/QUOTE]

Sorry about that. I have never heard that doctors use seals - I do not think such a seal exists in the states. I just searched quickly and the closest match was doctors and Navy SEALS. I looked at the RSTC form for the US nd Europe and there is not a place on the form or the instructions for a seal. Sorry you went through all of this.

 

[mbs]

Man BS bureaucracy! So his take was that you could forge the doctors signature? Why go to that bother when you could just check no for everything on the form. Pure silliness!

 

[dlofting]

It's been a few years since I had to have a letter from my doctor but if I recall correctly he had a stamp with his name and license or registration number on it, that he used. Maybe that is what they meant by a seal.

 

[though13]

@Damselfish Thanks for finding that. I wish I would have found that before the trip. Problem is I didn't even know the name of the dive op until I got there. I am definitely going to contact the cruise line and alert them. This info should be made available at time of booking the excursion.

@mbs EXACTLY! Like, if I wanted to lie, I would just say "no" to everything and be done with it. Why go through the trouble of forging a form?

@dlofting Thanks for the info - very interesting. I will reach out and see if they have something of the sort.