Long hose slipping out of the webbing while diving / Dive light task loading

[Joris Vd]

Hello dear scubaboarders,

Recently I've been diving alot with people who have very DIR-oriented views , and they kept pressing me to change out some stuff in my gear setup to dive completely DIR-conform.(computer was high on left arm with light right and compas was on left crown of the hand + 5 foot long hose )

There are two things that really take some getting used to and I wanted to ask some input on:


First the long hose 5 vs 7 foot:

I dove the 5 foot long hose from my first couple of dives, and thought it was very comfortable because it wraps perfectly, when diving wet. But changing to a drysuit with thick undergarments in winter, it's been getting very 'tight' .
So I've changed out to a 7 foot hose .
I've been diving it for a while now, and although I generally like the extra length it gives me, and comfort,but it annoys the hell out of me that it always slips away from under my webbing, making it very sloppy. making it necessary for me to restow it endlessly during a dive or everytime I move significantly.

Also changing the lamp from right to left was a real adjustment for me, this mainly because i feel like there is so much task loading because for almost every action you have to take the goodman handle out of your left hand, then hold it with your right hand, (dump gas, inflate, etc.) and then continue.

Does this just take getting used to, or is there a way to reduce the task loading with the light?

Before I have a dive light with cable and goodman handle I just clipped the lamp to a d-ring and dove with it attached to the upper d-ring, in case I had to donate air then, I would just drop the lamp which would stay on the d-ring so I wouldn't blind my buddy?

Has anyone else faced theseproblems? Solutions?

 

[tmassey]

That certainly sounds like you've got a *lot* going on!

If your dive count is correct, it sounds like you're simply task-loaded. It's not the specific things, it's *all* of the things.

I came to the items that you're adding much more slowly. I learned to dive a drysuit in full rec gear (i.e. jacket BC and single tank). I added just that one skill after about 100 dives, and it was like learning to dive all over again. Easily 25 dives before I was comfortable.

I added BP/W at probably 150 dives. Again, just that one thing. That didn't take long, but it was an adjustment.

I added a canister light at probably 250 dives. It was a couple of dozen dives before I even understood the concept of moving the light around!

I guess this is a long-winded way of saying be patient. You've added a *massive* amount of finicky gear. Like a race car, it'll do things that simpler gear won't do, but it takes a *lot* of skill just to back out of the driveway. And you barely have any dives, so you look and feel like a person learning to dive in a Ferrari. It'll come, and if you have good mentors they can help you.

And as you get better at basic skills (like buoyancy, like buoyancy in a drysuit!), the rest will get easier. You'll need to move your light around less when you use your inflator less to add and remove gas less. Everything builds on itself until one day you realize you're not even *aware* of the light: it's simply there, and you're handling it correctly without conscious thought.

I guess the only thought I would have would be: do you *need* the light? Once you're much more solid with adding/removing gas, *then* add the light. That would reduce the task loading quite a bit, and when you're ready, adding back the light will be much easier.

But either way, just keep doing things correctly. Doing that will most likely mean doing everything more slowly. It's easier to add speed than accuracy. The more you do it, the easier it becomes.

 

[Scared Silly]

Given that you are tucking the hose into your waist belt, I assume you do not have a can light or pocket on your right side. Which helps with the 7' hose issue. However, there is nothing magical about having a 5' or 7' hose. They just happen to be the std length sold. Even with a can light my wife finds the 7' hose to be too long, our solution, a 6' foot hose. Though she dives a 5' hose most of the time on her singles rig.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Are you guys diving in caves or in overheads with restrictions?
Is there some specific reason you are using 7’ long hoses besides just trying to be DIR?
Why not try a 40” on a 70 degree swivel at the second stage and run it under your right arm? There’s no wrapping and problems with extra hose and it tucks nicely against your body, nothing sticking out to get snagged, and still gives the recipient room to function.
Unless you’re planning on filing out of a restriction single file while sharing air, a 7’ hose is somewhat pointless.

 

[PfcAJ]

A pocket on the right waist strap helps a lot. Halcyon also makes this little plastic stick that slides onto the webbing to hold the long hose in place.

No need to take the light off your hand to add gas. Dump, yes, but not to add.

 

[halocline]

Since you liked the 5ft hose with a wetsuit, I would suggest you simply get a hose a little longer for the drysuit. The 7ft hose serves one purpose; it allows for single file air sharing in restrictions. If you are not diving in restrictions, there is no reason to use a 7 ft hose. An easy, convenient way to zero in on the perfect length hose is to buy a cheap hose coupler, then string together 2 shorter hoses, experimenting with length until you find the best for you. Then if you want you can order a hose that length. It's not that expensive. I bet 66" is probably about what you want for the drysuit if 60" works well with a wetsuit.

Some DIR divers, especially newer ones, can get downright evangelical about their methodology. DIR has some excellent ideas that originated from the hogarthian divers (early cave divers) but don't fall into the black hole of blind adherence to every detail, especially considering it was originally intended for cave diving. The principles are great, even for OW divers, but not all the details of gear set up will apply.

If you're using a canister light, or especially if you're considering buying one, you might be patient and soon enough they will be almost obsolete. For sure my next cave primary light will be cordless.

 

[Joris Vd]

Are you guys diving in caves or in overheads with restrictions?
Is there some specific reason you are using 7’ long hoses besides just trying to be DIR?
Why not try a 40” on a 70 degree swivel at the second stage and run it under your right arm? There’s no wrapping and problems with extra hose and it tucks nicely against your body, nothing sticking out to get snagged, and still gives the recipient room to function.

The guys I am currently diving with all do tons of overhead and restrictions in mines and caves. I am the only beginner diver in the bunch basically, they are just very adamant about doing it correctly from the beginning, as to not develop bad habits. I do plan on getting technical training in the near future (let's say in the next year or two or so, as soon as I have some more quality dives under my belt). The hose slipping is just something that really bothers me since I seem to be one of the few people who has this problem. I will try to tuck it with the canister, maybe that will help.

 

[JonG1]

I use bungee on my light head, tight enough that it just stays there, regardless of what I am doing, its a twin too but never seems to get in the way, I tried a Goodman but it as too thick and rigid to be able to do much with my left hand without removing it.

In terms of the hose, if you have a can light will it not sit under the can?

If not, and I don't have a can light, I have made hose retainers from a length of plastic plumbing pipe or electrical conduit, a loop of bungee around the pipe then pushed through a hole drilled at the top and knotted forms a slider to slip it onto the belt, which makes it easily removable when I am on CCR, plus its peanuts to make and can be customised to suit wear your hose loop ends up.

 

[CptTightPants21]

Sounds like you have a lot of new things going on and are a little bit task loaded.

As you experienced, 5ft can be a little small depending on body type and drysuit undergarment considerations. I don't recommend swapping hoses based on wetsuit or drysuit or getting a non standard hose length. I have dove with a 7ft hose in single and double tank without issue. The extra length is more than just for single file restrictions, even in open water air share it gives the divers some breathing room so they do not have to be right on top of one another. If you are going to be doing technical training in the future, keep the 7ft. There are a number of dummy canisters or hose holders on the market--Extreme Exposure sells a nice thin one, I think Halcyon sells a larger fake battery pack size one. Below is youtube video showing one from Apeks. I have used these and I have also used tucked the hose into my waist band.

With the tuck in method, it may have slipped out once or twice, but it was never consistent or a major issue. There has to be something going on. Your webbing/waist strap may not be tight enough--they should be very snug. Also, what is causing you to put so much tension/pull on the long hose--turning your head, looking around, even digging, shouldn't put that much pull on a 7ft hose--perhaps placement is suboptimal and you don't have enough slack as you should.


I like canister lights more for the combination of factors they provide than any one overarching factor. The canister holds the long hose, canister batteries have longer burn times, and the cord can act as a safety tether if the light head is accidentally dropped from your hand or somehow becomes unclipped--I can't say it's the biggest risk, but I had one time where I wasn't paying attention and the light slipped from my hand. I have also seen more than a couple cordless lights gets dropped and go all the way to the bottom--either the diver wasn't paying attention or they went to clip it off, thought they had (they hadn't), and just let it go. It sounds like you were doing a little bit of cheating with regards to your light head always clipped off. In technical training, that method won't fly bc all the bottles and extra equipment need the space. As with all things, using the goodman handle and light in the left hand just takes time, I don't even notice it anymore.

 

[JohnnyC]

Take a piece of PVC and cut slots in it and use it to capture the long hose. No need to spend real money on it. Tucking sucks, I get why people do it, but everyone I see that tucks the long hose ends up with it out of their waist belt.

You're task loaded because you're inexperienced. It will get better with practice. Don't beat yourself up over it. Everyone starts somewhere, and major changes to configuration require time to adjust.

Some of the things make sense once you delve deeper into the methodology. Computer on right arm because you reference it while you're adjusting your buoyancy, light head on left hand because getting blasted in the face with a 21w HID when you're OOG is a bad time to go blind, that sort of thing. We keep it on our hand and not clipped to a d-ring because we can control it when it's on our hand, and since we communicate with light signals, we want to make sure we're not giving bad information, or setting a precedent of poor light discipline that could bite us later.

Dive more, practice more, and all of your issues will become nonexistent. Diving with experienced, solid, divers will always help you improver your skills. Sometimes that requires doing things their way. As long as they can articulate why you should be conforming to their standard, you should come out ahead of the game.