LDS arbitrary tank fill rules.

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Rich Keller

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Location
Long Island NY
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I have heard a lot about Local Dive Shops that make up arbitrary rules about what tanks they will not fill. I am talking about the types of shops that will not fill aluminum tanks over 10 years old or steel tanks over 20 years old as examples I have seen on SB. The most common argument I see from shop owners is "my shop, my rules" and if they have a right to make up goofy rules I should have a right to know who they are so I can choose not to patronize them. I would like to put together and post monthly a list of LDSs who make up their own rules on what tanks they will not fill. I would like the name, address, phone number, web site and what their actual policy is. If you would rather not post this in an open forum please feel free to email me the info instead.
 
Good luck on finding written, published policies!
And be careful of libel based on hearsay rules.....
 
On occasion I take road trip through Florida. I bring a couple of tanks with me usually. Good luck getting any aluminum tank over ten years old filled and good luck with the old steel 72 cf tank (my favorite). Yes, there are shops that will fill them but there are so many who will not I now just buy two new aluminum 63s for the trip to use for beach dives and of course for boat trips, I rent the cylinders. My Jeep appreciates not toting a bunch of heavy tanks anyways.

I put a vintage Voit decal on a brand new snow white Faber steel 84. One particular well known SoFla dive chain would not fill it because it was "too old" despite my pointing out it was just a decal and the tank was BRAND NEW!

These are private businesses, I agree they can and should fill only what they are comfortable with, there are no regulations that can force a retail dive business to fill any tank new or old. What is next, tank anti-discrimination laws? If a tank comes in wearing a hoodie --------.


What I want, if I do anymore SoFla road trips, is a diesel Toyota HiAce and me get my compressor pieces assembled.

N
 
Good luck on finding written, published policies!
And be careful of libel based on hearsay rules.....

That is why I asked for their web sites. If their policy is there I would post the link to that. If it is not I would use the contact info from the site and ask them to confirm or deny this is their policy. If they think their policy is right there should be no problem saying so but if they feel the need to hide the policy then you know they are doing something underhanded.

---------- Post added August 16th, 2014 at 12:13 PM ----------

On occasion I take road trip through Florida. I bring a couple of tanks with me usually. Good luck getting any aluminum tank over ten years old filled and good luck with the old steel 72 cf tank (my favorite). Yes, there are shops that will fill them but there are so many who will not I now just buy two new aluminum 63s for the trip to use for beach dives and of course for boat trips, I rent the cylinders.

That was one reason to try to get a list together. If you are going to a place that only has 3 shops and 2 of them will not fill your tank then you go to the one that will.
 
Do you include not filling 6351 alloy aluminum tanks as a "goofy" rule? I think all the shops in my area (Greater Toronto Area or GTA) refuse to fill these tanks, e.g. Tank Fill Policy - Dive Source Scuba.

That is a very clear, mostly sensible policy. I'm not sure about requiring an inspector signature on a non-shop VIP sticker.
 
Do you include not filling 6351 alloy aluminum tanks as a "goofy" rule? I think all the shops in my area (Greater Toronto Area or GTA) refuse to fill these tanks, e.g. Tank Fill Policy - Dive Source Scuba.

No, though I do not agree with that policy as long as the tank has passed all the required tests, they have what is in their mind a legitimate concern based on facts. It is the shops that make up rules that all aluminum tanks over a certain age regardless of what alloy they are made of will not be filled that I feel are doing the wrong thing. There are also shops that will not fill steel tanks over a certain age that they have no basis at all to justify that policy. The link to the shop that you posted is up front about the policy, explains why and stands behind what he says. I have no problem with someone who does business that way.
 
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I had a tank VIPed on May 31, and commented to the shop that "gee - you could have put July 1 as the VIP date, just to save me a month." The shop owner agreed and told his tech to change the sticker. I said to the tech, who had also done the VIP, "if it was your tank, what would do?" His answer was "I'm the one standing next to it when it gets filled."

I guess there's truth to his comment, although if it was safe on Saturday, I don't think it will rust overnight and become a hazard on Sunday.
 
All true comments and the shop has the right to give service to whom they want and how they want. I think that for some areas it warrents such over protections. Exasmple I was out and came across a pair of divers man and wife who do deep air dives. They spoke long on 200+ ft on a single al 8o. I asked how do they do that . Thier responce was you start with 4k in the al 80. If that were a common practice in an area. then no shop really knows what they are getting at thier fill atation as opposed to a al80 that hs always been properly filled. Another factor is that many shops do not have qualified tank fillers. They dont know how to recognise the bad al's from the good al's so they make a shop rule to fit all. This shouldnt apply to steel tanks but somewhere some one wont fill older steel tanks cause the walls are thinner. So clearly there are some shops that are a bugger short of a full nose of snot. As for my self I bought lp steel tanks to avoid the al issues. But I have found shops that would look for the birth date of the steel tank before filling. I routinely get my lp tanks filled to 3k not because I ask but because the fill monkeys dont know the difference between al and steel let alone lp steel. They just fill to 3000 and stop and a 2700 psi fill is a full tank to boot. Imasgine having hp steel tanks and getting a fill to 3k adn cooling to 2800. I love my lp's almost as much as the compressor in the garage.
 
I should have a right to know who they are so I can choose not to patronize them. I would like to put together and post monthly a list of LDSs who make up their own rules on what tanks they will not fill. .

I don't get the point of this project. Certainly, where you live, you know which shops will do what, don't you? So don't go to the shops you know won't fill your tank.

If you are going to dive in an area where you don't know the shops, wouldn't it be easier just to call (or email) the shops and ask them about your particular tanks? "Hey, I've got an AL80 that's 15 years old but with current VIP and hydro. Do you have a policy that you won't fill the tank?" Seems like a lot less effort than trying to build a blacklist.

What if someone checks your blacklist, finds that a shop is not on it but shows up at the shop and finds out that it won't fill his tank? Are you going to include a disclaimer that not all shops are on the list and that the diver should call first to verify that the shop will fill his tank?

What happens when you get tired of updating the list, and the list is months or years out of date, the shop's practices have changed, but the post still shows up on Google searches for the shop's name? Are you going to include a disclaimer that you are not obligated to keep the list up to date and that the diver should call to verify that the shop won't fill his tank?

So why shouldn't a diver just call the shop and find out whether there is an issue with filling the tank?
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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