How fast do you swim in the cave?

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hroark2112

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A little background will help.

Most people look at me and figure I can’t swim fast or keep up with the group. I’m working on losing some of the gut, but most peoples first impression is that they’ll be waiting for me. my CCR Cave instructor thought that when we first met.

Day 2 of the course and I got yelled at for swimming too fast. Oops. I thought I was just going at a normal pace, but everyone else was having a hard time keeping up. 2 others in the group told me they could not catch me if they tried. It was explained to me why it was bad to out swim everyone else...I totally get that theory! The next dive I led I did slow down but then the next day in Little River I pretty much left them in the dust (inadvertently!!). Another stern talking to and the threat of multiple out of air/lost line/lost diver drills if I didn’t slow the hell down. On the last dive in Little River I was much slower, everyone was happy and smiled, no more threats of nasty drills!! To be honest it was a much more fun dive that way.

My instructor commented that he thought I was going to be the weak link on swimming and was shocked that I was as strong a swimmer. I guess my joke about having a swimmers body (Orcas are fat!!) was accurate. One thing he kept telling me that I really did not understand was “slow down and enjoy the cave!!” Wait...enjoy the cave?? I’m one step short of terrified and you want me to enjoy the cave???

On my first dives after class I was with 2 OC divers at Peacock. The lead guy told me his instructor said he dives at a snails pace, so I was ok taking up the #3 spot in the team. We did Peanut Tunnel > Peanut Restriction > Olson Sink > Olson Line on the dive. We had intended to go to Orange Grove but we took a wrong turn. I had thought things were starting to look really familiar since I had done the Olson side a number of times in my class, and after the sink I knew exactly where I was.


Those guys were FLYING through the cave. I almost had a hard time keeping up. Then I got it. I didn’t enjoy that cave at all! He told me his instructor kept telling him he was too slow and he needed to speed up. I was definitely confused!

So what’s the right answer? Slow down and enjoy the cave? Or speed up and get farther? I’ve watched hundreds of videos on YouTube (I know, not always the best source) and I’ve never seen anyone flying through like that. I understand if you NEED to get out, and you pick up the pace to deal with an OOA diver or dead rebreather. But just speeding through to say you made it the whole way just seemed silly.
 
Slow down in my opinion. Not only to enjoy the scenery but to conserve air and ultimately make it further before hitting thirds. I dive lp85s and last time i dove peacock i made it to waterhole with plenty of air left. Not sure what the norm is but ive been told a lot of guys cant do that on 85’s. I believe slow and steady plays a huge role.
 
Things are a bit easier in CCR, but OC you have to find the sweet spot between where you can making good progress vs working to hard.

We typically planned to 40-50ft per minute. Closer to 50 in low flow caves like Peacock, and closer to 40 in flow caves like Ginnie. But flow caves weren't consistent swimming, but work/rest cycles particularly on the mainline and pushing through restrictions. To gauge my buddy's ability to keep up, I keep my hand down and watch for my buddy's beam with it. I also dial my light down when needed.

Peacock is an amazing cave, once you get off the commonly traveled routes. Like Peanut is pretty cool after crossover. Waterhole, Olsen Bypass, Cisteen, Nicholson, the Well... lots of stuff to see. I have two dozen dives in P1 and I've actually never done the traverse between P1 and OG, one of these days I might, but there is still a ton to see without the complications of the traverse.
 
A little background will help.

Most people look at me and figure I can’t swim fast or keep up with the group. I’m working on losing some of the gut, but most peoples first impression is that they’ll be waiting for me. my CCR Cave instructor thought that when we first met.

Day 2 of the course and I got yelled at for swimming too fast. Oops. I thought I was just going at a normal pace, but everyone else was having a hard time keeping up. 2 others in the group told me they could not catch me if they tried. It was explained to me why it was bad to out swim everyone else...I totally get that theory! The next dive I led I did slow down but then the next day in Little River I pretty much left them in the dust (inadvertently!!). Another stern talking to and the threat of multiple out of air/lost line/lost diver drills if I didn’t slow the hell down. On the last dive in Little River I was much slower, everyone was happy and smiled, no more threats of nasty drills!! To be honest it was a much more fun dive that way.

My instructor commented that he thought I was going to be the weak link on swimming and was shocked that I was as strong a swimmer. I guess my joke about having a swimmers body (Orcas are fat!!) was accurate. One thing he kept telling me that I really did not understand was “slow down and enjoy the cave!!” Wait...enjoy the cave?? I’m one step short of terrified and you want me to enjoy the cave???

On my first dives after class I was with 2 OC divers at Peacock. The lead guy told me his instructor said he dives at a snails pace, so I was ok taking up the #3 spot in the team. We did Peanut Tunnel > Peanut Restriction > Olson Sink > Olson Line on the dive. We had intended to go to Orange Grove but we took a wrong turn. I had thought things were starting to look really familiar since I had done the Olson side a number of times in my class, and after the sink I knew exactly where I was.


Those guys were FLYING through the cave. I almost had a hard time keeping up. Then I got it. I didn’t enjoy that cave at all! He told me his instructor kept telling him he was too slow and he needed to speed up. I was definitely confused!

So what’s the right answer? Slow down and enjoy the cave? Or speed up and get farther? I’ve watched hundreds of videos on YouTube (I know, not always the best source) and I’ve never seen anyone flying through like that. I understand if you NEED to get out, and you pick up the pace to deal with an OOA diver or dead rebreather. But just speeding through to say you made it the whole way just seemed silly.

Here's an interesting question that I think contributes far more than any of the other background information you provided. Do you have any OC cave experience?

Things that could impact swim speed:
Vis
Scooter
# of stages/bailout
Experience in system
Experience with buddy
Flow
OC vs CCR
Team size (solo,2,3)
Complexity of the dive plan
Quality of rest going into the day
Caloric reserves
Water temp
Mission/target oriented vs leisure

Short answer, most people go too fast. If you can't mentally rewind and remember the cave (and especially the past few hundred feet in detail), you're going too fast. Leisure swimming dive with decent vis with someone that's never been in the system? 25-30' a minute.
 
No, I went straight to CCR cave with several long bailout swims during class. At Peacock I had 2 full 80’s for bailout, plus a fresh scrubber, which is double or more what I’d need to get to safety at any point on the plan.

Honestly I couldn’t tell you anything about the Peanut Restriction, except that I did watch both guys go through first to learn the best way through. I felt like we were doing double the speed limit!!
 
Slow is the key. You will get further going slower and you will be a better diver going slower. I wasn't speedy when I first started cave diving, but regardless over the years I have slowed down tremendously. By going fast you're:
-annoying your buddies
-not seeing enough of the cave to pick up the fine details that will help with "progressive penetration" and you're definitely not finding the spots that will keep you out of flow
-increasing your chances of a CO2 hit (regardless of OC or CC)
-Not going to get as far because higher work means higher O2 needs and therefore more gas used (though CCR that's not a big issue).
-Leaving your buddies behind to fend for themselves. Honestly if you were getting that much team separation you should have figured it out on your own when you were no longer seeing your teams' lights. That could also be a factor of going too fast, building a little CO2 in your bloodstream and getting a little tunnel vision and not realizing. Your instructor should have dinged you hard for that. Leave your team in the dust once is a learning point. Do it repeatedly and you should get drilled till your blue in the face.

Besides being unsafe divers, swimming too fast is the second most common reason I choose to not continue diving with someone.
 
No, I went straight to CCR cave
Honestly I couldn’t tell you anything about the Peanut Restriction,!

That ain't good. If you made it through a decent restriction without a pretty good memory of it you were either narced, taking on some CO2, or had stress related tunnel vision.

Just for more info, are you currently full cave?, did you do zero to hero?, or go through multiple classes with breaks in between to get dive time in?, and did you use the same instructor throughout or have different instructors for different classes?
 
What's the point of diving if you aren't enjoying the view? I'm not a believer in swim fast to reach some point, either carry more gas, alter the plan or get a scooter. Just an unimformed non cave diver :D
 
Joe abused me pretty hard for it and the threat of what would have come on that last dive was enough to embed it into my brain forever.

Having 5 divers in the team, all with good quality lights, coupled with my experience level in the caves made it harder to gage how far ahead I was.

When Joe told me “You do NOT want to get too far ahead today...trust me!!” I believed him. It’s a lesson I won’t lose any time soon.

Personally I blame the fins. The blue Dive Rite XT fins are too fast!
 
That ain't good. If you made it through a decent restriction without a pretty good memory of it you were either narced, taking on some CO2, or had stress related tunnel vision.

Just for more info, are you currently full cave?, did you do zero to hero?, or go through multiple classes with breaks in between to get dive time in?, and did you use the same instructor throughout or have different instructors for different classes?

I definitely had some tunnel vision going on. I wasn’t narced.

I did the week long IANTD CCR cave course. I had Joe Dituri and Doug Ebersole as my instructors.
 
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