sharkmasterb
Guest
I'd love to hear opinions about "deep stops" ... experiances, comments, problems, I find they lessen hang time depending on what mix you have @ your disposal... any thoughts ?
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Karl_in_Calif
Banned
If you go up to the GUI for SEARCH and click on it, then type into the left-side window DEEP STOPS you will come up with a plethora of threads.
The last time we beat this subject to death, Bruce Weinke himself participated, posting to the effect that his own latest models make no certain rule for deep stops possible. You just have to crank through the algorithm, for every case, apparenty.
He is naturally enclined towards his own deco model, now updated, but he is also comfortable with Abyss software. He has serious reservations about DecoPlanner.
I personally like DecoPlanner, because the price is right, and 1000 GUE divers cannot all be wrong (the betas for DecoPlanner). None of them has died, yet. It is also very easy to use in my opinion.
ADVANCED DIVER MAGAZINE found that DecoPlanner's only weakness is not being adaptable to CCRs. I dont own a CCR and do not expect to anytime soon.
Where does that leave deep stops?
Guess you either subscribe to B.R.'s new tables, or buy Abyss, and let one of them calculate the deep stops for you.
I will stick to DecoPlanner for now. Abyss still costs too much.
That is all that was new that came of the last thread on this.
The last time we beat this subject to death, Bruce Weinke himself participated, posting to the effect that his own latest models make no certain rule for deep stops possible. You just have to crank through the algorithm, for every case, apparenty.
He is naturally enclined towards his own deco model, now updated, but he is also comfortable with Abyss software. He has serious reservations about DecoPlanner.
I personally like DecoPlanner, because the price is right, and 1000 GUE divers cannot all be wrong (the betas for DecoPlanner). None of them has died, yet. It is also very easy to use in my opinion.
ADVANCED DIVER MAGAZINE found that DecoPlanner's only weakness is not being adaptable to CCRs. I dont own a CCR and do not expect to anytime soon.
Where does that leave deep stops?
Guess you either subscribe to B.R.'s new tables, or buy Abyss, and let one of them calculate the deep stops for you.
I will stick to DecoPlanner for now. Abyss still costs too much.
That is all that was new that came of the last thread on this.
MonkSeal
Contributor
GAP also implemented RGBM. I made few dives based on GAP RGBM plan and noticed shorter deco time in repetitive dives.
Deep stops basically give the answer on free phase (bubbles) elimination which can only be done at depth. That's in the opposite with disolved phase elimination which requires diver to be as shallow as possible. Optimal deco is combination of both phases elimination.
BRW will probably participate in this discussion and will give more acurate explanation.
Deep stops basically give the answer on free phase (bubbles) elimination which can only be done at depth. That's in the opposite with disolved phase elimination which requires diver to be as shallow as possible. Optimal deco is combination of both phases elimination.
BRW will probably participate in this discussion and will give more acurate explanation.
BRW
Contributor
Guys,
Just a quicky about your posts.
Both GAP and ABYSS offer RGBM. GAP RGBM is
newest. ABYSS RGBM goes back 5 - 6 yrs, and should
be current. I have received emails that ABYSS RGBM has
some programming probs on repets. That's intrinsic to
ABYSS, not RGBM.
RGBM is in Mares, Dacor, Suunto, Hydrospace, Plexus,
computers, and soon Zeagle and Steam Machines (RBs).
Hydrospace has an RGBM simulator with its Explorer
computer.
NAUI has released RGBM rec (air and nitrox to 10,000 ft)
and tec (air, nitrox, helitrox, trimix, heliox) deco tables.
RGBMdiving.com also offers standard air, nitrox, helitrox,
heliox, and trimix tables for open circuit and rebreather
(constant ppO2 = 1.4 and 1.4) tec and deco diving. Custom
RGBM tables can also be requested and cut there too.
Deep stops are self consistent in RGBM. If you don't
use it for staging, try the 1/2 then 1/2 then 1/2 method.
Check with me for the times and methodology too -- given
your profile, mix, and switch schedule. Avoid GFs unless
you know how to use them -- have experience.
On DPlanner, the only thing I have noticed is a long
Haldane deco tail in the shallow zone AFTER deep stops,
and as such, is overly conservative, and incongruent with
real phase models like tested RGBM
MonkSeal -- right on in your quicky explanation of dual
phase RGBM, bubs, and dissolved gases.
Bruce Wienke
Program Manager Computational Physics
C & C Dive Team Ldr
Just a quicky about your posts.
Both GAP and ABYSS offer RGBM. GAP RGBM is
newest. ABYSS RGBM goes back 5 - 6 yrs, and should
be current. I have received emails that ABYSS RGBM has
some programming probs on repets. That's intrinsic to
ABYSS, not RGBM.
RGBM is in Mares, Dacor, Suunto, Hydrospace, Plexus,
computers, and soon Zeagle and Steam Machines (RBs).
Hydrospace has an RGBM simulator with its Explorer
computer.
NAUI has released RGBM rec (air and nitrox to 10,000 ft)
and tec (air, nitrox, helitrox, trimix, heliox) deco tables.
RGBMdiving.com also offers standard air, nitrox, helitrox,
heliox, and trimix tables for open circuit and rebreather
(constant ppO2 = 1.4 and 1.4) tec and deco diving. Custom
RGBM tables can also be requested and cut there too.
Deep stops are self consistent in RGBM. If you don't
use it for staging, try the 1/2 then 1/2 then 1/2 method.
Check with me for the times and methodology too -- given
your profile, mix, and switch schedule. Avoid GFs unless
you know how to use them -- have experience.
On DPlanner, the only thing I have noticed is a long
Haldane deco tail in the shallow zone AFTER deep stops,
and as such, is overly conservative, and incongruent with
real phase models like tested RGBM
MonkSeal -- right on in your quicky explanation of dual
phase RGBM, bubs, and dissolved gases.
Bruce Wienke
Program Manager Computational Physics
C & C Dive Team Ldr
flw
Guest
At one time I used decoplanner, got bent on it, which I probably deserved at the time, however it wasn't a particularly adventurous or extreme dive, and asking around minor bends seemed relatively common in the 70m/20-25 minute range using the same settings.
I now use a ccr anyway, so I'd have had to have switched schedules.
I'd be interested in anyone's experiences with vplanner in the 85m plus range, I've toyed with it, but never used it in anger
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