Halcyon = not "DIR"

[MartiniTime]

I just spent 25 days tech diving in Thailand. For the trip I purchased a Haylcyon 55lb rig, just to see what I thought of these products.

I was highly un-impressed. The wing was inferior. First the stainless inflator sticks, both open and closed. Closed is an annoyance. A stuck inflator on a deep ocean dive however, is huge safety issue, with a run away ascent getting you a trip to the chamber or dead.

The over all design was also sub standard. The collar portion of the wing is too narrow, and the reduced length inflator, when strapped down, cause another restriction. This lead to uneven amounts of air dispersed on each side of the wing. You are constantly shifting the air between each side in order to get level.

Additionally the cover of the bladder for the rear dump valve would come un tucked. The dump valve would retreat beneath the layer, causing further aggravation locating the string.

The harness, and the back plate where fine, though the insistence on no quick releases seems silly to me, that’s an arbitrary and personal decision.

I did not use the lift bag, as I was diving wet, so I have to withold judgment, even though my initial hunch is that it too was sub standard. Why bother disconnecting your drysuit or LP inflator just to shoot a bag?

I have withheld any judgement on DIR diving, not having done extensive training under the philosphy. Since the equipment is so integral to the diving though, I have to question the whole concept.

Seems like clever marketing to sell a product. Which actually fine by me, thats capitalism at its finest. However the DIR pundits on here who regularly recommend these products, especially to new divers; need to have there motives (or judgement) questioned.

 

[Boogie711]

LOL - I'm not passing comment on anything you said, except to say that the second to last line in your signature is downright funny, considering what you just wrote.

 

[cornfed]

I was highly un-impressed. The wing was inferior. First the stainless inflator sticks, both open and closed. Closed is an annoyance. A stuck inflator on a deep ocean dive however, is huge safety issue, with a run away ascent getting you a trip to the chamber or dead.

Looks like you're part of that 2%. The SS inflators were just recalled.

The harness, and the back plate where fine, though the insistence on no quick releases seems silly to me, that’s an arbitrary and personal decision.

Wait a minute, I thought you said halcyon wasn't DIR. Kinda stupid to argue they're not DIR then suggest they put a quick release on their harness.

I did not use the lift bag, as I was diving wet, so I have to withold judgment, even though my initial hunch is that it too was sub standard. Why bother disconnecting your drysuit or LP inflator just to shoot a bag?

Why don't you actually do like you said and withhold judgement until you've used it?

I have withheld any judgement on DIR diving, not having done extensive training under the philosphy. Since the equipment is so integral to the diving though, I have to question the whole concept.

Who's guarding your bridge?

 

[darkpup]

Here's a copy of the recall notice put out on the Quest list. It was passed along to me via the wetspotters e-mail list. Hopefully I'm not breaking any copyright issues by posting it here. I believe the recall notice hit the Quest list yesterday (5/26), so this information is quite recent.

Halcyon Inflator Recall Notice:

Halcyon is recalling all stainless steel power inflators. The only units affected can be easily identified by their stainless buttons and started shipping on all Halcyon BCs after Oct 21, 2003. This recall is in response to problems experienced by some Halcyon customers. Identification of the cause was unusually difficult due to the odd dispersion of these problem units. Furthermore most customers report that their units are performing flawlessly. However, there are pockets of unacceptable failures in which customers or dive shops seem to have a grouping of unreliable inflators. Given the nature of this failure, there is no way to ensure that a unit performing properly will not develop problems over time.

Typically, the problem expresses itself as a slow leak into the BC bladder. The cause of the leak relates to small imperfections within the machining of the stainless air barrel of some inflators. Not all of the inflators exhibit the machining flaws. Thus, a majority of the units perform flawlessly but groupings of product might display the imperfections. We believe there to be no responsible alternative but to institute a recall of every stainless steel inflator sold by Halcyon. In order to ensure this recall occurs in the most responsible manner possible, we have contacted the U.S. Products Safety Commission and notified them of the return. They are monitoring the recall process and the return of the units.

Halcyon is deeply apologetic for any inconvenience this recall might cause. We are dedicated to making the world's best diving products and to ensuring diver safety at all costs; this solution seems the only reasonable course of action. Please do not use your BC with the Halcyon stainless steel power inflator until we have had the chance to replace the suspect unit. This recall only applies to Halcyon inflators shipped after Oct 21, 2003. These units have stainless steel buttons and are easily identifiable from previous Halcyon inflators.

In order to reduce the inconvenience and to return your BC to operation as quickly as possible, we are shipping new inflators to your local Halcyon dealer. You may bring your inflator to your dealer, trade it for a new unit, and have it fitted to your buoyancy compensator. Please contact your local Halcyon facility to coordinate the best time for this warranty replacement. If this solution is not feasible, please contact Halcyon using the following information:

386-454-0811

800-Halcyon (425-2966)

techservices@halcyon.net

If you prefer to send your Halcyon inflator directly to Halcyon please call or email to obtain a return authorization number. This number will significantly assist in the speedy return of your new Halcyon inflator.

Please include your return authorization number with your return and send the unit to the following address:

Halcyon Manufacturing
ATT: Tech Services
1110 S. Main St
High Springs, FL 32643

Be sure to include return shipping information with your inflator. If you have any questions please feel free to contact us. We will be very happy to work with you in any way that supports your satisfaction and safety.

Sincerely,
Jarrod Jablonski

Halcyon CEO

 

[MartiniTime]

LOL, I just added the Stroke line today. I find it amusing.

I did not know the inflators were recalled, is that on the halcyon web site? - Just checked, yes there is a recall. Where did you get the 2% number? The web site said all of them did'nt it? Either way, at least they are trying to fix the issue. Hopefully no one gets hurt from it.

Like I said the harness was fine. I prefer a quick release, by as I said, its an abitrary and personal decesion. I am not arguing they are not DIR, and I arguing that are not actually "doing it right." They are essentially the same as any other manufacturer.

I doubt I'll ever use the lift bag. Why would I want to disconnect anything, when it is simpler to just use a self sealing bag and exhale normally?

I am not really bashing DIR diving per se, like I said, I dont have the experience to bash it. I am saying the Halcyon products are nothing special, and dont rate the recomendation they get on here.

 

[Boogie711]

If you have a problem with the phrase "Doing it Right" what's your opinion on the company "Dive Rite?"

 

[MHK]

I just spent 25 days tech diving in Thailand. For the trip I purchased a Haylcyon 55lb rig, just to see what I thought of these products.

Seems to me that the more sensible approach would be to practice with "new" equipment is shallow water before doing technical diving with equipment you aren't familiar with.

I was highly un-impressed. The wing was inferior. First the stainless inflator sticks, both open and closed. Closed is an annoyance. A stuck inflator on a deep ocean dive however, is huge safety issue, with a run away ascent getting you a trip to the chamber or dead.

The over all design was also sub standard. The collar portion of the wing is too narrow, and the reduced length inflator, when strapped down, cause another restriction. This lead to uneven amounts of air dispersed on each side of the wing. You are constantly shifting the air between each side in order to get level.

Additionally the cover of the bladder for the rear dump valve would come un tucked. The dump valve would retreat beneath the layer, causing further aggravation locating the string.

While there appears to be a small problem with the inflator recently, in fact Halcyon just anouced a recall, the fact is that if you are diving at the level you claim to be trained disconnecting an inflator, in the unlikely event of it sticking, shouldn't be any problem at all. If you are diving at the technical level and can't do that then I suspect you need to take a step back and practice in the shallows. Admittedly, even the small 2% of the inflators that Halcyon recalled isn't ideal, but they stepped right up to the plate and recalled them once they found out about the problem.

The harness, and the back plate where fine, though the insistence on no quick releases seems silly to me, that’s an arbitrary and personal decision.

If the harness is fit correctly there is no need for quick releases, but it would also appear that buy purchasing the rig you accepted the "personal" decision..

I did not use the lift bag, as I was diving wet, so I have to withold judgment, even though my initial hunch is that it too was sub standard. Why bother disconnecting your drysuit or LP inflator just to shoot a bag?

Surely in your vast amount of training in your RecTec program they explained that there are 3 kinds of lift bags:

1) Closed cell
2) Open cell
3) Semi-closed

If you are diving wet and purchased the wrong piece of gear then why would you blame Halcyon for that??

I have withheld any judgement on DIR diving, not having done extensive training under the philosphy. Since the equipment is so integral to the diving though, I have to question the whole concept.

There is way more to the DIR philosophy then the standardized equipment configuration. Frankly, it's a small part of the totality of DIR diving..

Seems like clever marketing to sell a product. Which actually fine by me, thats capitalism at its finest. However the DIR pundits on here who regularly recommend these products, especially to new divers; need to have there motives (or judgement) questioned.

Our motives are questioned and challenged on a regular basis and we are extremely comfortable discusing every element of our philisophy, but since I noticed that you are Rec Tec trained and are complaining about the lift bag, would you mind justifying, defending and explaining the lift bag shooting procedure listed on Page 128 of the Rec Tec manual??

Hope that helps

Later

Michael Kane

 

[Uncle Pug]

the second to last line in your signature is downright funny, considering what you just wrote.

I found the first three words of his sig line a hoot considering he has to keep fiddling with the wing to balance it out.

Too many Martinis MartiniTime?

About the bag inflation... I prefer to use my lp inflator hose rather than hold a reg under an open bag... but at least one GUE Tech 1 instructor is teaching his students to inflate the bag by blowing one breath into it as that doesn't change your buoyancy.

 

[cornfed]

Where did you get the 2% number?

Halcyon estimates only 2% of the inflators are affected, but yes the are recalling all of them.

 

[MechDiver]

I haven't had any of the issues with my 55# Explorer that seem to be bothering you. I also have the closed bag and also have no issues using my drysuit hose to inflate it.

And, I am far from DIR. Equipment, in many cases, is what you make of it.

MD