Glue to Cordura fabric BC?

[Rred]

My old (OLD) SeaQuest BC is probably genuine Cordura cloth, also known as "ballistic nylon". The kind with a separate urethane bladder. I have done some mods in the past, where I unzipped the BC, removed the bladder, and stitched to the nylon to add or change things. But I'd like to replace a couple of "belt loops" that were stitched to it, without having to take things all apart again. I'd like to be able to GLUE new patches on, to use as the new loops.

Funny thing is, I can't seem to find any glue (E6000, Goop, 3M's exotic yellow contact cements...lots of things) that will make a "can't pull it off" bond to the Cordura cloth. This is not PVC or one of the other "looks like nylon" cloths, it is the real deal. Someone in the business suggested a semi-flexible epoxy, but I need flexible, not a guessing game with $50+ epoxy kits.

Has anyone found anything that bonds to Cordura?
Or do I just have to break down and play Dr. Frankenstein again?

 

[cool_hardware52]

"Cordura" is not ballistic. Cordura is a Dupont Brand name. 1000 denier is the max I've ever seen.

True ballistic nylons are a duplex 1050 denier weave, meaning 2 x 1050 denier filaments are twisted together and then woven into the fabric. One can think of ballistic as "2100" denier, 2 x 1050.

"1680" denier "ballistic" is in fact imitation ballistic produced using a single 1680 filament to create the look and hand of true duplex 1050 at lower cost.

Both Cordura and Ballistic are nylon, and both often has a "kiss coat" of urethane glued to the non finish surface. I would not trust any adhesive. Both are fabrics and are easily joined by sewing. If you are sufficiently motivated you could use a sewing awl.

Good luck,

Tobin

 

[Resqdivemedic]

Have you look into Aquaseal? I know its used to repair cordura waders. I have used it to repair ice rescue suits which are a coated cordura type fabric with good results.
Aquaseal & Cotol-240 Cure Accelerator

 

[tbone1004]

to continue a bit on what @cool_hardware52 said, duplex weaving is also used in industrial carpet applications. The history of ballistic nylon is actually pretty interesting, but you can read that elsewhere.

anyway, regarding a glue that won't pull off. it doesn't exist. Especially with UV degradation, if you take it in chlorine, etc etc. It's going to come off eventually. best to sew it in

 

[Rred]

Resq-
Yes, I've used Aquaseal for many things over the years and while it will stick to the BC, if it is used to glue on nylon tubular webbing, you can pull the webbing back off (with some effort) after it has had 24 hours to cure. Not the same bond that Aquaseal gets on neoprene.

tbone-
I don't dive in chlorine or under blacklights. Not much other UV really hits my BC, not enough to degrade anything. So those are non-starters. I'm familiar with environmental effects of glues and goos, that's not the problem here. As for glues not lasting forever...try putting duct tape over epoxy while it is still wet, and letting them cure up together. Incredible bond strength way beyond what you'd think "duct tape adhesive" could ever have. Or try gluing up Hypalon, with the right adhesive and with anything else. Huge differences.

cool-
Thanks for clarifying that, I've only seen the two terms used interchangeably by "luggage" makers, referring to a heavy material, usually a heavy Cordura. I can't even swear the BC is Cordura, SeaQuest isn't quite sure what they used back in the day either. And the urethane coating that you are referring to is "calendared" onto nylon in an effort to waterproof it, as in tri-lam drysuits, and the interior of some backpack/daypack sections. Inevitably, the coating delaminates and peels off within five years or so, no matter who makes it or how well it is treated. This is not a laminate, it is just one woven fabric which resists gluing. The specialty $50-150 kits of exotic adhesives claim they will work--but it just seems like there should be a less exotic alternative.

 

[cool_hardware52]

And the urethane coating that you are referring to is "calendared" onto nylon.

No, it's an adhesive laminate. You *might* want to check Lamcotec. They have been my supplier for many 1000's of yards of laminate over the last 10+ years.

Tobin

 

[Rred]

Thanks, Tobin. That's news to me, it always used to be heat calendared. Does your glue-lam come apart after a few years, the way the old stuff always does/did?

 

[cool_hardware52]

Thanks, Tobin. That's news to me, it always used to be heat calendared. Does your glue-lam come apart after a few years, the way the old stuff always does/did?

No.

Tobin

 

[tbone1004]

Resq-
Yes, I've used Aquaseal for many things over the years and while it will stick to the BC, if it is used to glue on nylon tubular webbing, you can pull the webbing back off (with some effort) after it has had 24 hours to cure. Not the same bond that Aquaseal gets on neoprene.

tbone-
I don't dive in chlorine or under blacklights. Not much other UV really hits my BC, not enough to degrade anything. So those are non-starters. I'm familiar with environmental effects of glues and goos, that's not the problem here. As for glues not lasting forever...try putting duct tape over epoxy while it is still wet, and letting them cure up together. Incredible bond strength way beyond what you'd think "duct tape adhesive" could ever have. Or try gluing up Hypalon, with the right adhesive and with anything else. Huge differences.

cool-
Thanks for clarifying that, I've only seen the two terms used interchangeably by "luggage" makers, referring to a heavy material, usually a heavy Cordura. I can't even swear the BC is Cordura, SeaQuest isn't quite sure what they used back in the day either. And the urethane coating that you are referring to is "calendared" onto nylon in an effort to waterproof it, as in tri-lam drysuits, and the interior of some backpack/daypack sections. Inevitably, the coating delaminates and peels off within five years or so, no matter who makes it or how well it is treated. This is not a laminate, it is just one woven fabric which resists gluing. The specialty $50-150 kits of exotic adhesives claim they will work--but it just seems like there should be a less exotic alternative.

textile engineer btw, so this is literally what I do for a living. Regarding the epoxy and duct tape, most of that is probably the epoxy grabbing onto the fabric inside of the duct tape directly as opposed to the adhesive on the duct tape, so probably a bad analogy.
Regarding ballistic nylons and Cordura. Most of it is not calendared on because of delamination. Most manufacturers use a hot melt film that is applied directly to the fabric to get the results they need. Drysuits will typically use a combination of both technologies in order to get the best balance of airtight, durability, and cost, but individual layers are typically done with a hot melt lamination machine as opposed to a calendar.

If you are gluing nylon onto it, I think the company is realtek but they make a product called Bondit B-4x that actually chemically bonds to the nylon a la epoxy. Use a bit of fine grit sandpaper or steel wool to rough up the areas first and it will create one helluva seal

 

[Couv]

I'm not a textile engineer nor a wing manufacturer; however I have attached belt loops onto a BC a couple of times-one was actually an older Sea Quest. I used a sewing awl (see Tobin's post) to attach the loops. Put a piece of fabric on the inside too. The first loop can be a learning experience, but after you get the hang of it the job goes relatively quickly.