Diving in a 'Group'

[TyTy]

On more than one boat/divemaster guided dive I've been on (even in my OW certification course) I have heard the 'we will all stay in a group/stay together/follow me.' One time a lady then asked, so who is my buddy, the reponse was 'we will be diving as a group so just stay in the group'.

Basically what I mean is I dont want anyone depending on me as a group member when I am diving with my buddy, nor do I want anyone worrying about us seeing as how we are a self sufficient diving pair.

It just seems like in OW certification class and in the book you dive with your buddy, period. But then in the real world it often times seems like this 'we are diving as a group' prevails. So what is the basic procedure to not 'dive in a group'.

 

[TyTy]

BTW, the 2 times this has happened to me my buddy we just planned our dive and agreed that we are diving with eachother and eachother only and basically stay with 'the group' as best we can but dont worry or depend on them.

Im thinking it would technically be good to make it clear to the DM that is what we are doing but then again they might put up a fuss or might cause conflict.

 

[Charlie99]

There is nothing that prevents you and your buddy from staying together. OTOH, if you agree to dive with the group, then you and your buddy have committed to staying WITH the group until you ascend.

If you don't wish to dive with a guide or in a group, you should call up and discuss this with the dive op before you show up on the boat.

As with all dives, you should have agreed upon turnpoint pressure, ascent procedures, and lost diver procedures.

In some group diving, all divers return to the mooring and/or ascend when the first diver reaches the agreed upon pressure. In other situations, particularly drift dives, a diver reaching the ascent pressure ascends, along with his buddy.

In any case, you, your buddy, and the DM/guide should all have a mutually agreed upon dive plan before you enter the water.

 

[TyTy]

There is nothing that prevents you and your buddy from staying together. OTOH, if you agree to dive with the group, then you and your buddy have committed to staying WITH the group until you ascend.

If you don't wish to dive with a guide or in a group, you should call up and discuss this with the dive op before you show up on the boat.

Im not talking about staying in a group as in hanging around eachother, Im talking about 'who is my buddy?' 'We arent using buddies, we are just going to 'stay in a group'.

I went on one of these sorts of dives and there was a girl, first time breathing underwater, got a quickie course on the boat and then was told to 'stay in the group'. Nobody checked her SPG, when I was at about 1,000 I swam over and checked hers, she was down to 800, I had to swim over to the DM to let him know where she was at. She had no buddy, as did none of the other divers. My buddy and I were the only two people on the 10 person or so dive that actually stayed together, communicated underwater, did a predive plan, etc... Everyone else was just wandering around in different areas with the two DM's looking around every once in a while.

Thats the kind of thing Im talking about.

Maybe what Im asking is 'staying in a group' an acceptable alternative to the buddy system?

 

[Charlie99]

Maybe what Im asking is 'staying in a group' an acceptable alternative to the buddy system?

Is the "loose buddy group" system of diving as safe as true buddy groups? NO WAY. But it is convenient and hasn't killed too many divers, so it will continue to be common in resort areas.

Each diver is still responsible for his safety, and if he/she is so unsafe that they need a personal babysitter, then they should hire one.

 

[TyTy]

In any case, you, your buddy, and the DM/guide should all have a mutually agreed upon dive plan before you enter the water.

Exactly, Ive been on about 4 boat dives and NONE of them did any of this. They all just said something along the lines of, 'we will all just stay together, keep the DM notified of your air and everyone should surface with 500 in the tank, alright, lets go diving!'.

This sort of thing seems contrary to my dive training and in each instance I just made a plan with my buddy and dove that plan while staying with the group. Especially when visibility is like 20ft or so there is no way 10 people can be in a group and be able to see each diver at all times (youd have to be stacked like sardines), yet every guided dive Ive dove with has used that same dive plan regaurdless of low visibility.

 

[Damselfish]

As far as I'm concerned I'm always diving with my buddy. Even if the pair of us are staying near a group - because they insist, or just because - I'm still diving with my buddy and we will let the DM know that. If we are supposed to ascend as a group or do whatever we will, as on some dives these things makes sense. But I try to stay away from dive ops that want to enforce group diving/herding for no good reason.

But, I'm not going to do what the group does if it's unsafe or stupid. They can yell at me later. All DMs are not good and sometimes they do silly things.

Now when diving with a group of people you get to know a bit or another pair we know, buddy switching has been known to occur at the end of the dive, and I think it's fine in the places I dive, as long as everyone knows what's going on. And I will sometimes hang out with a group under a boat at the end of a dive in shallow water after my buddy goes up, it's somewhat common for people to do that on easy tropical dives. But in those situations I could bail easily enough if something happened.

 

[El Orans]

On our Bonaire trip we usually dove with a group, consisting of several buddy-pairs.

 

[TyTy]

On our Bonaire trip we usually dove with a group, consisting of several buddy-pairs.

That would be great, that is what I think should happen. But what if the DM is basically saying this dive will have no buddies, just one big group? I have taken the same attitude as Damselfish though, forget that Im with my buddy, we'll stick with the group but Im not diving ina buddy group.

My question is, should I notify the DM of that? I guess I should and I kind of did one time but they just insisted that Im a newbie and they have 10 million dives and that is how they always do it that way.

 

[Charlie99]

Exactly, Ive been on about 4 boat dives and NONE of them did any of this. They all just said something along the lines of, 'we will all just stay together, keep the DM notified of your air and everyone should surface with 500 in the tank, alright, lets go diving!'.

This sort of thing seems contrary to my dive training and in each instance I just made a plan with my buddy and dove that plan while staying with the group. Especially when visibility is like 20ft or so there is no way 10 people can be in a group and be able to see each diver at all times (youd have to be stacked like sardines), yet every guided dive Ive dove with has used that same dive plan regaurdless of low visibility.

Don't be bashful about asking for clarification. It's not a sign of inexperience to ask. If you don't understand a certain thing, there are probably others on the boat that also don't understand, but are too bashful to ask. OTOH, it may also have been covered by a general boat briefing done even before boarding, or the DM may just assume that you all remember certain things from diving with them the day before. In any case ASK FOR CLARIFICATION!

With a diveop/DM I haven't dove with before, I often get strange looks when I ask "How many divers will be in the water?" Kind of like the inverse of your

Basically what I mean is I dont want anyone depending on me as a group member when I am diving with my buddy,

, I usually know where all members of the group are at any time. When starting out in diving, it's hard to keep track of myself, much less a buddy. Then it starts getting easier. Then as you pay more attention, you find it easy to keep track of 6 or 7 divers while enjoying the dive yourself. You also learn that by watching those other divers, you will get to see more interesting marine life --- 6 pairs of eyes spot more than just 1.

Lack of prior agreement on ascent procedures has caused many incidents. At least once on Scubaboard someone reported an incident where they incorrectly assumed that the DM was their buddy and would ascend with them when they hit the ascent pressure. This led to a situation where the diver delayed his ascent to the point of being low-on-air.

Lack of prior agreement on lost contact procedures has caused excess excitement on the part of DMs and boat crew when either solo divers or a buddy group just "went missing" and continued their dive for many minutes after losing contact. Particularly, if the missing diver or buddy group is not aware of currents and/or agreed upon pickup point, this can easily lead to problems.

From your last post, it sounds like it was a live boat drift dive. The reason the crew/DM can get away with such a minimal briefing is that they don't have to worry about getting airhogs back to the anchor or mooring line. The boat drifts along watching the bubbles and picks up any divers that ascend early, as long as they stay more or less above the group.