Difference between Utd and Gue?

[tracydr]

Can you explain the basic training differences between these organizations for tech training? Also, I know there aren't any GUE instructors in AZ. Are there any UTD instructors in the state? What classes does UTD offer for tech and how long does each one take?

 

[Blackwood]

Can you explain the basic training differences between these organizations for tech training?

Standards and Procedures:

UTD
GUE

UTD's tech progression is broken up into smaller steps.

UTD T1 = 25/25 bottom mix with oxygen deco gas, max depth of 130 (PO2 of 1.2ish). Check the standards for max deco time.

GUE T1 = 21/35 or 18/35 bottom mix with EAN50 or Oxygen deco gas (but not both). I believe in their latest standards they use PO2 rather than depth as the limit, and it's probably 1.2.

UTD T2 = 21/35 bottom mix with EAN50 deco gas, max depth of about 160 (PO2 of 1.2ish). Check the standards for max deco time. UTD also teaches use of a stage bottle in addition to the deco bottle. At this level it isn't used to extend bottom time, but rather to allow two dives on one set of doubles while maintaining rock bottom.

GUE T1 and UTD T2 are roughly equivalent. GUE offers a T1+ where stage bottles are introduced. UTD offers T2 Gold where the second bottle can contain a different deco gas, but with the caveat that it isn't to be used to do more aggressive dives (i.e. no 2:1 decompression dives on a UTD T2 Gold cert).

UTD Trimix 1 = 18/45 bottom gas with EAN50 and Oxygen deco gases.
UTD Trimix 2 = hypoxic trimix with multiple bottles and leash work, with some max depth.
GUE Tech 2 and UTD Trimix 2 are roughly equivalent.

GUE Tech 3 is basically irrelevant (in practice, anyway). UTD offers Trimix 2 Gold which eliminates the depth limit.


A fundamental difference is how decompression is covered. UTD teaches Ratio Decompression as the primary means to plan dives. GUE teaches desktop software as the primary means to plan dives, with Ratio Decompression as a backup. [I believe this is still true]

Also, I know there aren't any GUE instructors in AZ. Are there any UTD instructors in the state?

North American UTD instructors (none in AZ): http://www.unifiedteamdiving.com/page/usa-mexico-canada-based-utd

What classes does UTD offer for tech and how long does each one take?

How long? That's an open-ended question. It depends on the instructor and the student.

 

[Jasonmh]

No instructors in AZ, but let me put a quick recommendation in for George Watson in CO.
George teaches in CO, and the class dives in NM. There is a pretty good range of people in the group, from Essentials to Rebreather.
I would recommend contacting him for more info:
gkw@unifiedteamdiving.com

 

[tracydr]

Thanks for the very helpful information! Are there more UTD classes in So CA than GUE?

 

[ligersandtions]

Thanks for the very helpful information! Are there more UTD classes in So CA than GUE?

Not necessarily....courses are run on an as-needed basis. In other words, you generally don't wait for a course to pop up and then sign up for it, but rather contact the instructor you are interested in training with and have him set up a class for you.

I've taken classes from UTD and GUE, and all have been that way. If you're interested in a specific course (possibly with a specific instructor), contact him and get a class scheduled. I'm fairly certain that either UTD or GUE would be able to schedule a class for you when it's convenient.

 

[Peter Guy]

The OP asked

Can you explain the basic training differences between these organizations for tech training?

I've taken classes (and been involved with more) from instructors from both agencies and I, for one, could NOT explain "the basic training differences" since I'm not sure there are any "basic training differences" between the two agencies. Are there differences? Yes -- as explained by others above. But are there "basic training differences?" I really don't think so.

So what is it you REALLY want to know?

For example, I was diving with a UTD instructor (friend) last weekend who mentioned that he appeared to be serving as a gateway instructor (teaching Essentials) for GUE Fundamentals (taught by another friend). As far as I can tell, the "basic training" is very similar between the two agencies. Where there may be/is a significant difference is in their Cave programs.

 

[TSandM]

There are a bunch of small differences, but when it comes right down to it, a UTD-trained and a GUE-trained diver at the same level should be able to get in the water after a short discussion and do a very seamless dive.

As stated, UTD breaks training up into smaller chunks, which can be advantageous. GUE has a much more extensive cave diving faculty and a very well developed cave diving curriculum.

If you haven't done any of this type of training, I think you will find a class from either agency will be an eye-opener and a good educational experience. It may well come down to figuring out at what level you want to begin, and which instructor strikes you as fitting better with your personality.

 

[lamont]

dogs and cats
crips and bloods
israel and palestine
ben and jerry

 

[tracydr]

Lynne, when you say what level you want to begin, what do you mean? I know with GUE you start with the Fundies class. With UTD I noticed you could go right to Tech. Does that mean we would miss all the fundamental fine tuning of buoyancy skills and team building or is that covered in tech 1? Or, did I misread the algorithm for UTD?

 

[mikemill]

Lynne, when you say what level you want to begin, what do you mean? I know with GUE you start with the Fundies class. With UTD I noticed you could go right to Tech. Does that mean we would miss all the fundamental fine tuning of buoyancy skills and team building or is that covered in tech 1? Or, did I misread the algorithm for UTD?

UTD actually starts with an Essentials of Recreational Diving and/or Essentials of Technical Diving (which is basically essentials of rec + doubles & bottle handling) class as the skills introduction class.