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BHB collection/protection discussion

Discussion in 'Florida' started by dumpsterDiver, Apr 13, 2011.

  1. danvolker

    danvolker Dive Shop

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Lake Worth, Florida, United States
    5,884
    3,009
    So it is CLEAR that DD is not a Law Breaker. It is also clear that DD does not have any interest in "being a good neighbor", with all of the divers that visit BHB regularly. When some of us ( and I am pretty sure I called you this at minimum :D ) called you a poacher, this is a word that evokes the emotional response that 99% of us get, when we see someone collecting at the BHB Marine Park. We are using this term to make clear the way we feel about the behavior, and to convey it to you in a manner that could not be misconstrued as being only a mild problem for most of us. Legally, you are in no danger of prosecution for poaching. We will most likely continue to use this aptly descriptive term, for the emotional effect it conveys.


    I am still serious about taking you on a scooter run to any area in the intracoastal you think could be similar to thwe BHB in nursery ground potential--and I will video any such place in 1080P. There would be no doubt as to what the truth is....After covering huge areas all around BHB, the only other place with significant life ( biomass) is the Inlet/jetty area and channel. But while there are many reef fish here, there are no frogfish, few octopus relative to the BHB, and so far we have found almost no nudibranchs, no mantis shrimps, and none of most of the exciting finds people have at the bhb.

    The Peanut Island area for snoreling is horribly lame.... The area West of Annies Dock on the South Jetty is not bad at all, but not nearly as strong for Macro photographers as is the BHB. This is easy to show in videos.
    Go South of the turn from the south jetty western route, and you don't get far before there is nothing to see....and por vis.

    North of BHB, where the mangroves are, the life is sparse...over miles of mangroves, the life will add up , but it would probably take 15 miles of mangroves to equal the biomas of 1/3 of the BHB area. Again, we can video a 30 minute stretch of mangroves, and you can see for yourself. Luckilly, we have hundreds of miles of mangroves, for the life that is generated from these areas, but our point is that the BHB area is an EXPLOSIVE NURSERY GROUND for many of the rare species people travel all over the world to see---and the BHB area is exponentially more productive than the Mangroves, per ACRE.
     
  2. guyharrisonphoto

    guyharrisonphoto ScubaBoard Supporter ScubaBoard Supporter

    # of Dives: 1,000 - 2,499
    Location: Florida, USA
    1,992
    1,058
    Actually, I think there is a legitimate issue over whether DD's knifing of the flounder was legal. I do NOT want to give any impression that spearfishing as opposed to collecting is legal at the BHB. Those were not my findings. The County does not believe spearfishing (or knifing) is lawful at the BHB.

    I am also not sure that DD is an aggressive collector who wants to be a major threat to the site (despite his aggressive approach to questioning the status of the area), but time will tell on that. Even if that is true, my main concern is if MANY collectors take "in moderation" without considering their multiple impact, it can be a serious burden on the site.

    This is not to minimize other threats (water quality, silt kickers, and what is going on with the megayacht marina?).

    But collecting is also a serious threat because the life is so concentrated at the site, the site is so accessable, the vis is so good, that it is like shooting fish in a barrel compared to the effort of diving a reef or searching miles of mangroves and grass flats. Those of us who want protection of the site need to get behind either the sanctuary initiative, or at least a petition to the County to enact rules that prohibit collecting.
     
  3. dumpsterDiver

    dumpsterDiver Banned

    # of Dives: 2,500 - 4,999
    Location:
    9,003
    4,674

    This is getting kinda petty now but as i explained in some posts long ago.... spearfishing is not allowed adjacent (300 ft) to the portion of a bridge or structure from which hook and line fishing is allowed.

    So spearfishing is definitely prohibited within the area that divers normally visit under the big bridge because the fishing pier is located immediately adjacent.

    HOWEVER, knifing a fish is spearing not spearfishing and the FWC specialists have assured me (in writing)that spearing (with a knife) IS allowed within the 300 ft zone.

    In all honesty, there is no way we can expect Karen Marcus (county Commissioner) to be that well schooled on the details of the state statutes. So we can not be too critical of her, even though that one portion of her email was incorrect.


    t
     
  4. mrfixitchapman

    mrfixitchapman Contributor

    # of Dives: 100 - 199
    Location: Upper right-hand corner of Iowa, equally inconveni
    4,256
    8,925

    The Palm Beach County Parks and Recreation Department strongly
    discourages the taking of tropical fish from this area and we are
    working to better educate the public to "enjoy the area and leave it
    for others to enjoy". Currently there are no local regulations against
    recreational harvesting of tropical fish. However, you must have the
    proper salt water fishing license and must follow the regulations
    established by the Florida Fish & Wildlife Conservation Commission.
    These regulations are inclusive of the limits on the various species
    that can be taken and the means with which they can be harvested. The
    County Parks and Recreation Department neither owns nor has management
    rights for most of the submerged area around the bridge. We do not
    allow knives or spear guns to capture fish in the park waters so spear
    fishing in this area is not permitted.
    No commercial activity is
    permissible within park property unless authorized by the Department
    Director.

    DC
     
  5. Teljkon

    Teljkon Contributor

    71
    5
    So your willing to berate me for misspelling words and other such mistaken uses of the english grammer. Yet you have no problem constantly and consistantly miss using a word and it miss fitted definition on others. Your argument for emotional context is as flimsy and self serving as it gets. A poacher is a criminal a collector is some one you dont like huge diffrence dan. So :mooner: you and your double standard you hypocrite.

    I think that is what this is really all about it dosent have any thing you want to look at does it not. So were not really talking about bio load are we are talking about your acess to that bio load. The mangroves work in a way where the fish live far up in the root structure for saftey dan. you think they are just poping out when a big animal comes by making a funny noise. I.E you on your scooter or diving open circut. This whole thing really comes down to one thing.

    If i hapen to have the time I will come out and argue against you when you appeal to the county for turning this area into a sanctuary.
     
  6. danvolker

    danvolker Dive Shop

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Lake Worth, Florida, United States
    5,884
    3,009
    I have huge access.
    Boats, kayaks, scooters...
    .I can get to any site I want to.
    If the marine life [ at an individual site, anywhere else in the intracoastal] is unique, rare, or powerful in a nursery capacity, we would be thrilled to have it as an additional site many of the scientists we talk to weekly, would also be interested in for many key species typically seen ONLY at the BHB....

    I would consider that a personal favor. Thankyou! :D
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2011
  7. Splitlip

    Splitlip Contributor

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Jupiter
    3,913
    468
    Very eloquent post as usual.

    There are no "native" peoples living in any of the continental US states unless you consider the "Native Americans"; "Eskimos" and "Indians" who actually crossed from Asia.

    People moving to this State is the way of things. Tourists and new residents contribute to the economy and it's going to continue to happen. I for one am happy that the new comers are willing to be environmentally conscientious. I'm an almost native I came here from New York in the '70's. Like my parents and grand parents (also from New York), I believe in conserving what this State offers in the way of natural resources. That is unlike many of the "true natives" I know (I married a 3rd generation KW Conch descended from British who settled the Bahamas). The ones who think it is their right to take craw fish shorts, fish out of season, bugs year round, turtle eggs, gators, turtles, conch, panther...because they were here when it was a wilderness. (for those who don't know, there is a gray market in the Keys for short lobster, Goliath Grouper, conch etc. Granted, the mean old FWC has had success cracking down on it all. It is still going though. I just returned from a 5 day fishing and hunting trip, and got the local buzz.)

    Judging by your writing skills I imagine you have not been on this planet more than 13 or 14 years, but maybe you learned this from your Dad or Pap.

    Honestly, people will continue to come to this state. Not just from New York, but all over the country and the world. Lots of Brits, Irish, South Africans, Dutch and Canadians. They bring $ and create jobs. And now with Max Planck coming to Jupiter/Gardens we'll see more Germans.
     
    danvolker likes this.
  8. imwright1985

    imwright1985 Contributor

    # of Dives: 25 - 49
    Location: West Palm Beach, FLorida
    567
    9
    I think people need to be educated. Today dove BHB and had 2 people ask if lobster were in the water. It isnt season, and even at that prior at walmart some of the lobster nuts I saw wernt even getting crustacian stamps. If you got people who dont even watch the news, to hear all the announcements and know whats going on, then post signs so there is no ignorance
     

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