Antigua- Jolly Dive Review

[jlcnuke]

Dove with them this week, and here are my thoughts on the experience-

Everyone was quite friendly, but that's the primary thing I can say positively about the experience.

Sure, not being in their rental rig is different (I use my BP/W with 5 ft/22" hoses and bring my own gear), but I'd expect that professionals with this amount of experience who say they take tech divers out would be able to swap out my gear on their own... apparently not so. negative point there

The only thing offered to guests on-board for food/drink is water. Maybe that's normal on Antigua, so I won't fault them for it, but I've never seen a boat before (Mexico, Florida, Bahamas, Aruba, etc) that didn't offer snacks of some sort between dives before. Neutral to negative points, let's give the benefit of the doubt and go neutral (certainly not positive).

They told me it was a "PADI requirement" that I give them a medical waiver since I have a medical condition... the morning I showed up to dive and filled out their form. Sorry, but that's unprofessional. If you're going to try and cancel someone's dives without such a thing, you plaster that on your website/communications/ask for the form filled out in advanced so you can let them know. Fortunately (or not) for me, I had one within the last year for courses I'd done, so I could still dive with them after jumping through hoops at the last minute. Oh, and that isn't a PADI requirement as they don't have a requirement for people to fill out a medical waiver to dive every time they dive, so negative points for lying to me before we even start diving.. negative points there.

Oh goody, I now have my instabuddy(ies) on the 7 guest trip (interesting since I was told they preferred to max out at 6 these days in emails, and one person didn't show so it would have been 8, not 6), plus 2 dive guides in the water.... oh goody, dive guides to point everything out to us... and then we're told to stay with "the group". -1 for not offering/letting people dive their own dive after the briefing.

So, let's splash.... and then see if we can make a new record speed around the dive site! Yep, that's right, the guides were all about making sure you pretty much never stopped moving. I'd spend enough time to check out 5 feet of the reef and notice the guide's fins were now barely visible. I'm not saying women use less air than men, but women tend to use less air then men, and at 60 ft a petite woman was at "time to go up" pressure in less than 35 minutes (along with about 1/2 the divers in total). So nice of them to let us go up in 2 groups since the racing speed boosted everyone's SAC rate to **** or else no one would have had a dive over 40 minutes long, despite the second dive only being 40 feet. Pro-tip - some people would like to see the reef, not just race around it to the 4 spots you're used to seeing something interesting in (yeah, on the second dive the guide pointed out a lobster then raced off, within 6 feet I found another huge lobster and a good sized crab, but no one else got to see either since they were racing after the guide... the first of many things myself and my camera were the only ones to see that dive).negative points there... by a LOT.

So, on a 0-10 scale, I'd give them a 1 or 2, depending on how generous I was feeling. Not a chance I'd consider booking with them again however, though I did enjoy the island itself and many other things there.

 

[drrich2]

What did you enjoy about Antigua topside?

Got an opinion of how the marine life and reef looked compared to any other oceanic diving you've done?

They told me it was a "PADI requirement" that I give them a medical waiver since I have a medical condition... the morning I showed up to dive and filled out their form.

Regardless, if you intend to admit any medical conditions (regardless how how trivial or well-controlled it is) on a screening form, you'd better be ready with a statement (e.g.: signed by a Physician) that amounts to medical clearance for you to dive. This topic comes up in forum threads fairly often, then segues into the debate over whether to conceal (a.k.a. 'lie about') conditions vs. get clearance from a doctor (who may know little about diving, making it a time and money-consuming formality), whether you or some 'higher authority' gets to decide whether you can dive, etc...

Bottom line, if you're going to admit you've got a condition, you'd better have a release to dive in hand when you get to the dive shop.

'Reef race' is a common complain about guide-led Caribbean dives. Some people like to see a spread of reef and cover ground hoping to stumble across 'big stuff' (e.g.: reef shark, eagle ray), some like taking extended time to set up photos or study, say, a single coral head awhile... You've been on other dive boat trips elsewhere so you have a basis for comparison. Did other customers criticize this aspect? Was anything said to the guide after the 1st dive?

If the deficiencies your perceived in the dive op. were corrected, or you found one comparable to what you've experienced elsewhere, would you want to make another Antigua trip? I've wondered why the island isn't more known as a dive destination, as it gets strong exposure in cruise ship itineraries.

Richard.

 

[jonhall]

Glad I found Indigo Divers in Jolly Harbor when I went to Antigua! Wish you could have found them as my experience was opposite yours.

If you're going to try and cancel someone's dives without such a thing, you plaster that on your website/communications/ask for the form filled out in advanced so you can let them know.

I have learned a lot because of my dive buddy who had a "widow maker" heart attack. Although the first 2 places we traveled to afterwards, the dive ops in Playa Del Carmen/Cozumel and Grand Cayman had no problem with the medical release statement from his doctor, our next trip to Dominican Republic was the one that opened my eyes. Because he checked that he had had a heart attack and a few other issues associated with the heart attack on their medical release form, they told him he couldn't dive, even though he had his doctor's release statement. We worked things out eventually.

I have been places where the dive op used their own medical release form and others that used the PADI medical release form (assume it was easier for them to just make copies of an existing form), but no matter what, I always contact the op(s) we plan to dive with and tell them about my buddy and ask if there will be any problems (in the DR, we wound up using a resort op.) If a medical release form is on the dive ops website, I usually, at the very least, read it (but usually print it) to see if my buddy needs anything special to be cleared to dive. We have been to Cabo, Bahamas, and Costa Rica since and have had no issues. I'm not even sure that he has had to show his doctor's release form. I guess that having only 1 out of the 8 ops we have been with since his attack that made it an issue are good odds.
*Antigua was one of 2 trips my buddy wasn't released to dive. He had to stay with the wives and wait for me to get back each day!

Bottom line, if you're going to admit you've got a condition, you'd better have a release to dive in hand when you get to the dive shop.

Yes!!!!!!

Thanks for the review.

 

[tkaelin]

Did you just do one dive with the op or did you dive all week? Can't tell from the title and post. Not sure I understand the first two complaints about your gear and waivers. Water on the boat not much to complain about. The one about the dive itself is all too common and part of the risks of doing a boat dive with a new op. Understand your frustration and complaint here. Some communication beforehand may have avoided, reduced or at least fleshed out how they dive. A good op on a boat dive usually slows things down and lets you go at a more reasonable pace.
The experience you described for your dive is why I now tend to avoid a lot of boat diving but I have found ops that do it differently. No instabuddyies. Nice slow pace. Space, time and leeway to drop out of the group and to finish your air under the boat if some burned their air faster. The bottom line though is on a guided dive, boat or otherwise, you tend to go on their schedule at their pace.

 

[jlcnuke]

What did you enjoy about Antigua topside?

Got an opinion of how the marine life and reef looked compared to any other oceanic diving you've done?



Regardless, if you intend to admit any medical conditions (regardless how how trivial or well-controlled it is) on a screening form, you'd better be ready with a statement (e.g.: signed by a Physician) that amounts to medical clearance for you to dive. This topic comes up in forum threads fairly often, then segues into the debate over whether to conceal (a.k.a. 'lie about') conditions vs. get clearance from a doctor (who may know little about diving, making it a time and money-consuming formality), whether you or some 'higher authority' gets to decide whether you can dive, etc...

Bottom line, if you're going to admit you've got a condition, you'd better have a release to dive in hand when you get to the dive shop.

'Reef race' is a common complain about guide-led Caribbean dives. Some people like to see a spread of reef and cover ground hoping to stumble across 'big stuff' (e.g.: reef shark, eagle ray), some like taking extended time to set up photos or study, say, a single coral head awhile... You've been on other dive boat trips elsewhere so you have a basis for comparison. Did other customers criticize this aspect? Was anything said to the guide after the 1st dive?

If the deficiencies your perceived in the dive op. were corrected, or you found one comparable to what you've experienced elsewhere, would you want to make another Antigua trip? I've wondered why the island isn't more known as a dive destination, as it gets strong exposure in cruise ship itineraries.

Richard.

Topside- The island itself is, outside of the cruise ship area of the main city, very beautiful. Nice hills and lush green coverings, with beautiful beaches and many opportunities for water sports (great windsurfing on the windward side of the island, numerous secluded beaches you can anchor out on if you have access to a boat, nice restaurants and good food throughout the island, and plenty of options for entertainment (from relaxing on beaches, resort activities, water sports, live bands at bars/restaurants, etc). Transportation can be quite expensive if you take a taxi everywhere, but if traveling much I'd recommend renting a car (~$60-75 US/day) or, if you aren't in a hurry and don't mind being a bit less luxurious, taking the local buses (very cheap).

Marine life/reef - probably on par with the dive at five-finger I did off of Playa Del Carmen in January of last year after a Norte (sp?). So the reef is alive, but not vibrant by any stroke of the imagination, and mostly juveniles with interspersed adult or maturing fish. I saw little pelagic life in either of the two dives I did on the SW side of the island, and non snorkeling in 10-30ft of water on the west side (leeward of Bird Island) or on the NW side. The reef shark we saw in the distance was a small one, but there were a healthy population of Southern stingrays both at the dive sites and where I snorkeled. Supposedly the island has a good population of turtles but I didn't see any when I wasn't out sailing last week.

Medical - I have no problem having things signed off to dive by my doctor, and I don't feel the need to lie about my conditions. I DO have a problem with a dive operation giving no indication that they are even going to ask about my medical history until the day of the dive and THEN, and only then, tell me they won't let me dive without it. If I didn't have internet so I could email them a copy of my Dr's latest medical sign-off then I would have missed the dives because they didn't communicate their requirements. I DO have a problem with them lying to me about it as well (it isn't required by PADI that they have me do a medical clearance sheet and Dr. sign-off to do a fun dive with them, not associated with any PADI course, despite them saying that was the reason to my face).

The guide's shifted after the first dive, and the first one was only "pretty quick", the second was the one trying to set Olympic records around the reef. Not knowing any of the other divers on the boat (tagged along with another buddy pair (well, ocean buddies), I didn't spend much time talking to any of them after the second dive.

I'd love to go back to Antigua, but not for the diving. The other watersports are great, and it's beautiful weather for sailing (the primary reason I was there) on a beautiful island with lots of enjoyment to offer.

 

[jlcnuke]

Glad I found Indigo Divers in Jolly Harbor when I went to Antigua! Wish you could have found them as my experience was opposite yours.



I have learned a lot because of my dive buddy who had a "widow maker" heart attack. Although the first 2 places we traveled to afterwards, the dive ops in Playa Del Carmen/Cozumel and Grand Cayman had no problem with the medical release statement from his doctor, our next trip to Dominican Republic was the one that opened my eyes. Because he checked that he had had a heart attack and a few other issues associated with the heart attack on their medical release form, they told him he couldn't dive, even though he had his doctor's release statement. We worked things out eventually.

I have been places where the dive op used their own medical release form and others that used the PADI medical release form (assume it was easier for them to just make copies of an existing form), but no matter what, I always contact the op(s) we plan to dive with and tell them about my buddy and ask if there will be any problems (in the DR, we wound up using a resort op.) If a medical release form is on the dive ops website, I usually, at the very least, read it (but usually print it) to see if my buddy needs anything special to be cleared to dive. We have been to Cabo, Bahamas, and Costa Rica since and have had no issues. I'm not even sure that he has had to show his doctor's release form. I guess that having only 1 out of the 8 ops we have been with since his attack that made it an issue are good odds.
*Antigua was one of 2 trips my buddy wasn't released to dive. He had to stay with the wives and wait for me to get back each day!


Yes!!!!!!

Thanks for the review.

I almost went with Indigo on Thursday, but decided to take the morning off (that I was out drinking with the crew of SV Delos Wednesday might have had something to do with that decision...), so I just did the two dives Friday that I had booked in advance with Jolly Dive (I was on the island to do my RYA Day Skipper practical course that was supposed to finish up Thursday, but cancelled halfway through when the rigging had an issue that couldn't be fixed until the weekend).

If their website would have had anything about any forms, medical, etc even mentioned anywhere, I would have had their forms filled out as well. Fortunately for me, the default form I get for courses worked (I have my doc do it at my annual exam each year so I always have one just in case). I prefer not to lie as, being a diabetic, it's pretty obvious that I have a medical condition when I'm checking my blood sugars between dives to make sure I'm still good to dive the next dive. It's not one of those things that you can explain away as not medical related really, and I'm not going to lie and then have to sit topside on the next dive when they notice and then refuse to let me dive.

 

[jlcnuke]

Did you just do one dive with the op or did you dive all week? Can't tell from the title and post. Not sure I understand the first two complaints about your gear and waivers. Water on the boat not much to complain about. The one about the dive itself is all too common and part of the risks of doing a boat dive with a new op. Understand your frustration and complaint here. Some communication beforehand may have avoided, reduced or at least fleshed out how they dive. A good op on a boat dive usually slows things down and lets you go at a more reasonable pace.
The experience you described for your dive is why I now tend to avoid a lot of boat diving but I have found ops that do it differently. No instabuddyies. Nice slow pace. Space, time and leeway to drop out of the group and to finish your air under the boat if some burned their air faster. The bottom line though is on a guided dive, boat or otherwise, you tend to go on their schedule at their pace.

I only dived with them on Friday.

I thought it was pretty obvious what I didn't like about the first couple things, but I'll expand, you pay a boat and you expect that they're doing some things in exchange for that money. They swapped everyone else's gear but my long-hose setup was too complicated for them to transfer to a different tank for me(???) so I had to do it myself (thus not getting one of the services that others get for the same price). To me, that's a negative and there's no reason they shouldn't have been able to give me the same service the other paying customers received.

Also, if you're going to have requirements to take someone out and you fail to disclose those requirements until it's possibly too late for your requirements to be met, then you've failed to conduct business properly. What if you went to the movies, paid for your ticket, and then were told that you needed an optometrist letter saying your eyes were good enough to watch the movie that starts in 5 minutes? Would that be acceptable? Of course not. Neither is having your own requirements that I have a medical sign-off to dive that you don't tell me about until it's too late to do anything about it if I don't happen to have already taken care of that issue without any reason to from you. That I happened to have one is irrelevant, the fact is that it's not a legal requirement or a PADI requirement, it's their requirement and they failed to disclose that requirement until right before leaving for the dives. That's poor business practices and something that puts their operation in a negative light in my eyes.

 

[drrich2]

I DO have a problem with a dive operation giving no indication that they are even going to ask about my medical history until the day of the dive and THEN, and only then, tell me they won't let me dive without it. If I didn't have internet so I could email them a copy of my Dr's latest medical sign-off then I would have missed the dives because they didn't communicate their requirements.

Thanks for the added info. I strongly recommend having a printed version of that medical sign-off in-hand whenever you show up at a dive op. to go diving. Sooner or later (likely sooner) it will spare you another such hassle.

I DO have a problem with them lying to me about it as well (it isn't required by PADI that they have me do a medical clearance sheet and Dr. sign-off to do a fun dive with them, not associated with any PADI course, despite them saying that was the reason to my face).

It may just be possible the person believed it was a PADI requirement. I imagine their liability insurance provider is the true 'culprit,' whether whether it's PADI for a course, or a liability insurer for recreational dives outside a class, it's probably all the same to the shop staff; it's required either way. Sometimes people don't know what they don't know.

Richard.

 

[drrich2]

Would that be acceptable? Of course not. Neither is having your own requirements that I have a medical sign-off to dive that you don't tell me about until it's too late to do anything about it if I don't happen to have already taken care of that issue without any reason to from you.

I hear you and I sympathize, you have rational supporting logic, and unfortunately I think you're going to find this scenario is not uncommon. And you're not the 1st to 'get burned' by showing up to dive somewhere and running into resistance due to the demand for a medical clearance. In another thread I recall a diver had to go see some Doctor in town to get one.

Richard.

 

[KathyV]

I have no experience with Antigua (I'm sad to say!) or with Jolly Dive but I just wanted to mention that a young woman recently posted on SB that she was sexually harassed by a boat captain from Jolly Dive, see the link below:

WARNING: Jolly Dive boat captain by name of Paul sexually harassed me