air source 3 shutoff

[klauricella]

Why is there are shutoff inline on this. The dive shop answer was in case it starts to free flow but the if you shut it off you have no inflator. The reason I am asking is we had a club dive this weekend with some new divers. One of them started having issues and I saw her headed for the surface. When I got to her I could not inflate her bc. I got her back to shore and they found that the inflator was shutoff. It seems if you where going to have this it should look like a shutoff not a piece of trim. We have advised her to either get rid out it entirely of replace the hose with a standard quick disconnect that the rest of the world is familiar with.

Thanks
Kevin

 

[flots am]

Why is there are shutoff inline on this. The dive shop answer was in case it starts to free flow but the if you shut it off you have no inflator. The reason I am asking is we had a club dive this weekend with some new divers. One of them started having issues and I saw her headed for the surface. When I got to her I could not inflate her bc. I got her back to shore and they found that the inflator was shutoff. It seems if you where going to have this it should look like a shutoff not a piece of trim. We have advised her to either get rid out it entirely of replace the hose with a standard quick disconnect that the rest of the world is familiar with.

I saw one and it's a stupendously bad idea.

If someone gets a freeflow on an alternate second stage underwater, they should disconnect it and get it serviced. Barring that, an alternate second stage/inflator should always work because a rescuer is going to expect it to.

As you discovered, it's quite "exciting" to attempt an air share or inflation at the surface and discover it's not working.

This "feature" could easily turn an annoyance into a fatality.

The answer to "why?" is marketing. It's a feature the manufacturer can legitimately claim to have an exclusive on.

flots.

 

[redacted]

Uncontrolled gas loss on a breathing device is a good time to end a dive. If such events are so common that a shut-off is included in the design, I think I would be looking at other equipment options. Hopefully it is just a sales gimmick and not a necessary capability.

 

[tphillipp]

I can assure you that it is not for marketing purposes and I will pose an argument that it is much safer to go this route.

Freeflow Control Devices (FCDs) are not new nor are they exclusive to Aqua Lung / Apeks. They have been around a long time. They are common among ice divers. Should a second stage freeze up under the ice, it is better to cut off the air to it rather than bleed the tank down.

Now to inflation devices. While it is rare, inflation devices can and do stick open. This can be due to malfunction, lack of service, contaminant, etc. Should an inflator stick open, the first thing to do is reach for the upper most dump valve and open it as a BC should dump faster than it inflates. Next the l.p. hose should be disconnected. The problem is that most divers do not reach for the dump valve. Some try to disconnect the hose but cannot do so with gloves on. They experience an runaway ascent. Instructors see this inability to disconnect the l.p. hose whenever they teach students who are wearing gloves. We argue that it is fast and easy to slide the FCD to the off position to stop that runaway inflation thus preventing an uncontrolled ascent. At this point, the dive is over anyway so the lack of air to the Airsource is not an issue.

Now, back to Kevin's club dive this weekend. It sounds as if this girl was not familiar with her equipment. As part of a pre-dive safety check, you make sure that your air is turned on, you breathe off of your regulator and alternate and you operate your inflator. IF her FCD was closed, she could not have inflated or breathed off of the Airsource. It should have been caught. It's no different than jumping in without opening your cylinder valve. The valve does not accidentally get moved to the close position during the dive. In fact, it is positioned in such a way that if the diver slides their hand down the hose or pulls on the hose (to dump air), it reinforces the open position.

BTW, the Airsource 3 is offered in both configurations - with a traditional QD fitting and with the freeflow control device. There is no price difference. The one with the freeflow control device is more popular and currently outsells the traditional unit with the QD fitting.

In summary, the product has been thought out carefully and enjoys an excellent following. If you find yourself disagreeing with all of this then you always have the traditional version to fall back to.

There - that should spawn a nice debate! Enjoy!

 

[klauricella]

Thanks for the reply, I hear your point but just disagree if this is a good argument you would put shutoffs on all your regs. What is supposed to happen and what does happen when a person is panicking are two different things. This person had about two dives in since her check out. Also it was me that could not inflate her BC if you are in the water holding someone up the last thing you think of is that there is a shut of on their equipment. Maybe it needs to be made clearer I looked at it in the dive shop and it is hard to tell that it is a shutoff. I think we will make sure that she changes over to a standard hose for the future.

Thanks
Kevin

 

[Nautica Tim]

Tom, thanks for posting on here so fast. The diver was aware of the shut off before the dive. Since I knew she was a new diver (she took her open waters with my daughter) I made a point of making sure she set up her gear correctly. When we were setting it up I noticed the on/off switch. I had seen one of these before and just knew enough to tell her to leave it in the on position. I made sure she not only breathed off her primary, I had her breath off her backup and had her make sure the she inflated her BC with the inflator button and had her do it manually to make sure everything was functioning correctly. How it got into the off position is what concerns me. I am going to take another look at the set up the next time I see her.

Thanks
Tim

 

[dmoore19]

If she doesn't like the on/off valve she can get the kit that changes it to the quick connect. That's what I did, but only because I wanted a diver alert added. Where was her buddy? Did they not do a buddy check? When I had the on/off switch I made sure my buddy knew my set up and how to turn it off.

 

[klauricella]

What I have seen from diving is that it is not always the buddy that does the saving. I know that is what PADI wants you to believe but it seems more often it is someone else like an instructor or DM that recognizes a problem before the buddy does. Could we have done a better job checking out each others equipment, probably. But this is something that is easily missed because it is so inconspicuous and different. Again if you are diving with a group and your buddy does not see you having trouble having little this like this can cause issues for the person trying to help you.

Kevin

 

[dmoore19]

What I have seen from diving is that it is not always the buddy that does the saving. I know that is what PADI wants you to believe but it seems more often it is someone else like an instructor or DM that recognizes a problem before the buddy does. Could we have done a better job checking out each others equipment, probably. But this is something that is easily missed because it is so inconspicuous and different. Again if you are diving with a group and your buddy does not see you having trouble having little this like this can cause issues for the person trying to help you.

Kevin

There is always the option of buying the quick disconnect and replacing the slide valve with it. Aqualung has been selling the Airsource 3 with the sliding valve for at least 4 years because I have one and that is the way it came. They only recently had the quick disconnect kit but it is available.