Frog kicking and ankle flexibility

[Chavodel8en]

@BlueTrin, you are correct. Lean back on the couch or floor and splay your knees out wide (that's hip rotation). When you do that, you'll see it's pretty easy to put the soles of your feet together. If you're flexible enough, you can get your legs pretty flat and your soles will touch with virtually no ankle movement. Now, you don't have to be that flexible to do a frog kick. The combination of hip rotation and some ankle movement can bring the bottom of your fins together. Also, don't get too caught up in touching the bottom of your fins together. Even if they aren't flat, you'll still likely find that you can propel yourself along nicely. Comfort is also the name of the game and that's what @Can't Talk ... Diving was getting at.

Now, maybe I know why my frogkick is crap. I can barely do what you describe - get my soles to touch, even w/ my legs splayed. It is not comfortable at all. I must add that I am not very flexible.

When I frogkick, its always a strain for me.

I dont know, I think some folks just arent built for frogkicking. I generally flutter. Im not in any confined areas, so it works for me.

 

[NothingClever]

If you’re having trouble with your frogkick, you might consider going to your local YMCA for some regular ‘ol breaststroke swim lessons for adults (3-4 lessons). Next thing you know, you’ll be able to frogkick a twinset around like it’s a go-kart.

 

[RyanT]

Now, maybe I know why my frogkick is crap. I can barely do what you describe - get my soles to touch, even w/ my legs splayed. It is not comfortable at all. I must add that I am not very flexible.

When I frogkick, its always a strain for me.

I dont know, I think some folks just arent built for frogkicking. I generally flutter. Im not in any confined areas, so it works for me.

Flexibility is a funny thing. I'm really flexible in some ways, but my hamstrings are so tight it's a struggle to just touch my toes. With a little practice, you can combine the hip and ankle movements to do a decent frog kick, even if you aren't touching the bottom of your fins flat. On the other hand, if you don't dive confined spaces and you have another kick that's comfortable for you, then do what works!

 

[AdivingBel]

I have a minor genetic nerve issue with my legs so a frog kick isn't the most comfortable for me. For a non-silting, kick & glide kick my go to is more of a side kick. By rocking your hips a bit to one side you can get a similar horizontal kick using the top of one fin and the bottom of the other. It has the added benefit if I start to feel a little strain, I can rock my hips the other way and reverse my fins. It's like having all new leg muscles. It's not as pretty as a well executed frog kick (though I've seen some ugly a$$ frog kicks ), but it's very powerful and non-silting. It lets me kick & glide comfortably. All IMHO, YMMV.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I can frog kick in my freediving fins. Even do a back kick. The technique is different and you have to realize what you are working with, but it can be done.

 

[EireDiver606]

@Hank49
I understand your point. I think you missed mine actually.
Yes you can do a frogkick in a freedive fin. Is it easy? No, not really for most.
My point was that no matter how good you are, freedive fins will not propel a diver carrying much more than a single tank in an efficient manner and certainly not with frogkicking in a small environment like a cave.
There is a reason most divers in caves/ technical diving use jet fins. They efficiently move you as theyre strong. Freedive fins are strong but flex not push when moving too much weight.

 

[TuckerIdaho]

Freediving fins are for freediving/vanila scuba, in a wreck or cave (or even close to a reef with a camera rig) and when performing tight helicopter turns, finning backwards, not disturbing, silt precise positioning etc they are terrible.

Even generic widespread fins like Mares Avanti Quattros are awful for frog kicking/helicopter turning/backwards finning. My Eddys are superior for all of these.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

...It appears that here on SB there are not a large number of finned swimming instructors, indeed. But possibly in your town there is a finned swimming club, and you can ask to go to the swimming pool with them. Remember, however, that most finned swimming clubs are mostly interested in competitions, so they are expert only of group 1)...

Angelo Farina's Home Page

What Angelo calls "finned swimming" is known in the USA as "finswimming." Indeed, there are some clubs that compete with finswimming in the USA, but not many. You can find out more from USA Finswimming - Home. In the 1980s, I was Finswimming Director for the Underwater Society of America, and we tried unsuccessfully to get this sport introduced into the USA Olympic program.

Now, about the frog kick. I've seen tech divers do it in two different ways, one with the bottom of the foot coming together in a normal frog kick from breast stroke, and one where they use the top of the fin. Some fins work well both ways (Jet Fins), and some don't (Force Fins will only propel effectively if a "whip kick" is used, using the top of the fins).

SeaRat

 

[Angelo Farina]

Now, about the frog kick. I've seen tech divers do it in two different ways, one with the bottom of the foot coming together in a normal frog kick from breast stroke, and one where they use the top of the fin. Some fins work well both ways (Jet Fins), and some don't (Force Fins will only propel effectively if a "whip kick" is used, using the top of the fins).
SeaRat

The second kick you describe is among the 10+ kicking styles which I consider generally wrong...
Using the upper surface of your fins can easily push water towards the bottom, raising mud or silt.
The main purpose of frog kicking is exactly for avoiding this...
Furthermore, people kicking that way tend to flex a lot their knees, raising their feet much above the body, with the risk of hitting the ceiling of the cavern. This would be absolutely unacceptable in caverns in Sardinia, where the ceiling is covered by delicate and precious red coral.