Interested in going Double Hose - need help

[halocline]

I don't find the weighting/trim issues between a modern reg and a double hose difficult to deal with, and you won't either. It's a fairly small adjustment that you can solve in one or two pool sessions. The benefit of the low (and close to your back!) placement of the double hose is mostly about getting the performance out of the reg. You'll find double hose regs are very position-sensitive with regards to breathing resistance. Once you adjust to that they are very enjoyable for diving.

 

[rhwestfall]

I would never be able to get horizontal as my feet would always be pointed to the seabed!

I still don't understand this comment.

FWIW - my comment of "frog kick" was because of this comment, I was thinking the tank would interfere with your kick as it might extend to a conflict with your thighs if scissor kicking..

 

[Daebado]

Unless you are really interested in doing your own service on a double hose, you will probably want to get a Kraken double hose from vintagedoublehose.com. Kraken orders are now on hold while he catches up on current orders.

Yes, the Kraken is what I am probably most interested in. I have been wanting to get into servicing my own regs for a little while, now so that box is checked!

You should be able to get your tank low enough on your BPW to be comfortable. If you need to move some weight, you can put some on a pocket on your cam band or shoulders.

It maybe as simple as changing where you put your weights. Pockets on the upper tank band allows you to shift weights from your belt or lower body up higher. I know of folks who attach a weight to the tank neck. I don't use much weight in warm water, 6-8 lbs max. I attach weights directly to my BP, they are not ditchable but I don't dive with air in my BC so I don't consider them not being ditchable a problem. With a full 80, at worst I am 3-4 lbs negative with no air in my BC, if I can't swim that up, I have bigger issues I need to address.

This is very much how I have my rig set up as well. Two pockets on my upper cam band; one on each side of the tank, with 2 lbs in each. That's all I usually need. Very little to no air needed in the BC at depth and I can swim the rig up with no problem.
It took me a while to dial this in to where I can stay horizontal and even with my tank up to where the 1st stage sometimes hits my head when I look up, I have to maintain a frog kick pose in order to keep my feet from sinking.
I worry that moving that tank down much at all will upset the delicate balance I worked so hard to achieve.

 

[Daebado]

I still don't understand this comment.

FWIW - my comment of "frog kick" was because of this comment, I was thinking the tank would interfere with your kick as it might extend to a conflict with your thighs if scissor kicking..

Understood, and I do appreciate your reply. I simply meant that I have heavy feet and that if I move my tank down, I probably won't be able to stay horizontal when hovering because my feet would sink and I would end up vertical.
I do frog kick as much as I can and that position is usually required for me to stay in a horizontal hover anyway because it moves my center of gravity forward. If I extend my legs, my feet are going to sink.

So, that being said, do people usually use smaller tanks when diving double hose regs? I've seen some twinset rigs that definitely look smaller so maybe they are using two small tanks to approximately equal one larger tank? That would make sense but I really don't want to have to start using double tanks if I can help it.

 

[Daebado]

This is the place you seek.

Vintage Double Hose - Index page

Crap! Shoulda known there would be a whole other forum dedicated to it! Looks like I have some reading to do!

 

[Daebado]

plenty of information on here about how to do it. Search posts by @herman did the prototyping of the Argonaut Kraken, @Luis H who designed it, and @Bryan@Vintage Double Hose who made sure the whole project happened. Videos on Bryan's youtube channel about them, and lots of posts in the vintage diving section here as well

Sorry tbone, didn't mean to leave you out! Whole lot of replies came through very quickly! That's what I love about this forum!
Thanks for the info. I'll look into these. I have a lot of catching up to do!

 

[rsingler]

Actually, an AL80 (not an ALN80 "neutral" tank) should be completely neutral around 2400 psi and butt light from that point on, due to the negatively buoyant valve and first stage.
So slinging it low may not hurt you as much as you think. But yes, ALN80's are butt heavy.

If this isn't intuitive, think about a tank that is ~4# positively buoyant when empty, but has more aluminum per linear inch of volume up at the neck. Add in the valve and first stage, and you'll see that an empty AL80 has its center of flotation more toward the tank bottom. The first three pounds of air don't swing that center of flotation past the middle of the tank. The next 2 1/2# (as the tank goes negatively buoyant) are marginally weighted toward the bottom of the tank (due to the bottom's larger volume than the shoulder/neck area), but not by much.

 

[GJC]

Understood, and I do appreciate your reply. I simply meant that I have heavy feet and that if I move my tank down, I probably won't be able to stay horizontal when hovering because my feet would sink and I would end up vertical.
I do frog kick as much as I can and that position is usually required for me to stay in a horizontal hover anyway because it moves my center of gravity forward. If I extend my legs, my feet are going to sink.

So, that being said, do people usually use smaller tanks when diving double hose regs? I've seen some twinset rigs that definitely look smaller so maybe they are using two small tanks to approximately equal one larger tank? That would make sense but I really don't want to have to start using double tanks if I can help it.

Might I suggest that you may benefit from a little more weight. If you are neutral with no air in your BC at the beginning of your dive, you are going to be too floaty at your safety stop with less air in your tank.

With that extra weight, if you move your entire BC a little lower on your body, the air in your BC that you will need to counter that weight should lift your feet a bit.

A little of the weight you are using, moved shoulder pockets, would also get your feet up.

 

[Nemrod]

Where in Kansas? I'm in the KC area. (Olathe)

And I am marooned in the Wichita area?

Push the wing down, get rid of the Hollis BP as it will never work with a DH regulator, move some trim weight up to the top cam band, use a neutral/lighter fin.

Conventional BPs that are originally designed for double tanks and then adapted to single tanks with an adapter (or a wing with the supports) are not workable at all with a DH. I have been there and tried it every way it can be tried, it just does not work. A soft plate like th eOxy Travel Plate, the Freedom Plate and best of all the VDH plate all work with double hose and si gle hose regulators just fine.

J

 

[GJC]

And I am marooned in the Wichita area?

Push the wing down, get rid of the Hollis BP as it will never work with a DH regulator, move some trim weight up to the top cam band, use a neutral/lighter fin.

Conventional BPs that are originally designed for double tanks and then adapted to single tanks with an adapter (or a wing with the supports) are not workable at all with a DH. I have been there and tried it every way it can be tried, it just does not work. A soft plate like th eOxy Travel Plate, the Freedom Plate and best of all the VDH plate all work with double hose and si gle hose regulators just fine.

J

A flat back plate is best, but a standard plate without a single tank stabilizer on it only moves the tank about 1 inch away from your body. That's what I have been using and I'm very comfortable breathing with it like that.