GUE position on lights

[PfcAJ]

Because it's a standard of the certification. A cord light is standard diving gear and to get the certification you need to be able to use the standard gear.

But everything should have a reason.

"Cuz I say so" doesn't cut it.

 

[seeker242]

But everything should have a reason.

"Cuz I say so" doesn't cut it.

"because you need to know how to use standard diving gear" isn't a good enough reason?

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

"because you need to know how to use standard diving gear" isn't a good enough reason?

The issue (to me at least) is that the GUE standards don't specify that a canister light is required for a tec pass. It seems to be inferred from discussions. It should be clear (my opinion, worth what you just paid for it: nothing.).

 

[PfcAJ]

"because you need to know how to use standard diving gear" isn't a good enough reason?

No, it doesn't explain anything. It really wouldn't take too much to turn that "reason" into something actually reasonable.

"Why do I need to learn to use a canister light? I don't have one and this works just fine."

"As you progress into a tech/cave class, being able to use team resources becomes more important. Imagine if your cordless light goes down and you're on a course or trip in a foreign country. Being able to use a corded light allows you to continue simply by using a teammate's or instructor's spare. I wouldn't want to send you to a course and have a simple equipment failure prevent you for being successful at that course."

 

[AlexL]

To gain a tech pass at fundamentals you must be able to manage a light cord while doing an S-drill and Valve drill.

Hey John! as mentioned by other posters in this thread before me, this is something that makes sense, but it is not described as such in the standards, policies and procedures as of v8.0:

Demonstrate proficiency with a primary light by using it during all skills except SMB
deployment.

2.2.3.9 (B) Equipment Requirements for a GUE Fundamentals - Technical Rating
GUE base equipment configuration as outlined in Appendix A, plus:
a. GUE double tank configuration
b. Primary and backup lights
c. Backup mask
Prior to the commencement of the class, students should consult with a GUE representative to
verify equipment requirements and appropriateness of any selected equipment.

When burn time requirements create the need for an external battery pack,
it should reside in a canister mounted on the diver’s right hip.

no mention of the primary being corded, or configured for an extended burn time. a minor revision to 2.2.2.9(B).b and 2.2.3.9(B).b to read as 'Primary light with external battery pack, and backup lights' would remove any possible ambiguity.

As a student who is preparing for their fundamentals tech upgrade, this was brought up with our instructor, and the response was 'the standards do not mandate a corded canister, but any progression past fundies requires the knowledge to handle a corded canister. it would be a disservice to the student looking to progress further to not cover cord management.'. effectively echoing what @PfcAJ and others described. so the 'students should consult' note did resolve the ambiguity.

 

[Rechno]

Thats the exact reason why I wanted to as, whether it really is a mandatory "standard"... when I started this thread I quoted the Annex A and asked, how this is interpreted. so this would be part a) of the question.

For part b)

"because you need to know how to use standard diving gear" isn't a good enough reason?

For me as an adult who does this as a hobby and wants to understand his gear, it is not a sufficient answer. During other "activities" seen enough guys running around with equipment they do not understand and only wear it because "that guy" also wears it.

 

[johnkendall]

Hi All,

As I said, it is a *requirement* for a tech pass to use a corded primary light for the S-Drill and Valve Drill. This isn't optional I'm afraid. It does not mean that you have to go and buy a corded light, nor does it mean you can't use your existing light for a lot of the training, it does mean that you have to show competence in using a corded light.
The reasons are many, but it basically comes down to something along the lines of what AJ has said, which is that there is a high likelyhood that you will end up needing to use a corded light (whether this is a primary, or a video light) at somepoint on any projects that you may get involved with. Making sure that you can safely manage your valves and donate gas to an OOG diver is an important part of fundamentals, and so we want to see that capability before awarding a Tech pass.

HTH
John

 

[Germie]

Nowadays you have backuplights with 7-10 hours burntime and bright enough to be a mainlight. Halcyon has now the 'focus' light, I believe that burns 5 hours? So in most technical dives, even in the end level trimix or cave courses such lights are good enough. But if you need to have a cable for a techpass, think easy, make some line on it and you have it. Just a little bit to find out what is a good line to be 'corded'. There is not written it needs to be a real cannisterpack. Halcyon has a pvc pod to be used as cannister for the longhose too, you are allowed to use pvc pipes on the harnass for this goal. So I don't see it as big problem, be creative. Or easy borrow it for that few dives of the course and then decide afterwards if you want a cable light or not. Save money and buy what you really want.
The skill with cable light is to make the cable and the longhose 'free'. It is not bad if you know how it works as there is a chance or you or your teammates will have one time a cablelight. I think 95% of the techdives is done with a cable light here.
BUT: I know some divers with handheldlights with goodman, some sold their cablelights. So the market of no cables is growing. But if I go by plane, I take recharable c-cells (allowed in plane), and some bright backuplights and a goodmannglove to fit it on top of my hand. Never had problems with this configuration in caves.


But if it is written like AlexL mentioned, then no cable light is needed.

 

[VR78]

As I said, it is a *requirement* for a tech pass to use a corded primary light for the S-Drill and Valve Drill. This isn't optional I'm afraid

Out of pure curiosity: would a hand-held light work in Fundies if it were connected with a length of a thin garden hose to a soda can secured to the belt with a few rubber rings?

 

[tbone1004]

why go through all of the effort vs. just borrowing one from the instructor or a friend? They're not unobtanium