Rebreathers

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That is a problem and seems to be getting worse as agencies push to make rebreathers and tech diving easier to get into. The art of planning and understanding is becoming lost because it times time to learn and bottom line lots of folk want to get a student in and out and get paid. Any one considering rebreathers should really be a tech diver first so they can learn to plan and understand the art side of diving. They should also have a mentor some one more experienced to keep them pointed in the right direction and helps them build experience. I teach naval flight students to fly and we teach them there are two things that will keep you alive training/knowledge and experience. You can't teach experience so a new diver only has knowledge and training to work with. CCR can be time consuming and expensive to get it to but the reality is it should be. Dive groups and agencies would help the sport greatly if the focused more on building mentors to help new tech divers safely gain that experience and understanding rather than try and just shorting the training making it easy to get them in and our the door and giving them this illusion that the unit will keep you alive all on its own and will tell you if something is wrong. It is a tool but just as any tool if used improperly, regardless if you knew better or not, can and will hurt you.
 
Rebreathers can be safer than OC for a diligent diver, diligent is the key word here, simply because there is the rebreather and a completely redundant OC supply also.

Rebreathers can also be nothing more than a suicide machine for a diver that is not properly trained with a full understanding of rebreathers in general and his unit in particular.

We are trained to deal with each and every possible scenario and thus it merely falls directly on the individual diver to make diving a rebreather safe or not.

Training, checklists, slow and careful progression, good buddies/mentors, adherence to the training, and never being afraid to turn a dive are some of the key items that need to stressed.
 
Rebreathers can be safer than OC for a diligent diver, diligent is the key word here, simply because there is the rebreather and a completely redundant OC supply also.

Rebreathers can also be nothing more than a suicide machine for a diver that is not properly trained with a full understanding of rebreathers in general and his unit in particular.

We are trained to deal with each and every possible scenario and thus it merely falls directly on the individual diver to make diving a rebreather safe or not.

Training, checklists, slow and careful progression, good buddies/mentors, adherence to the training, and never being afraid to turn a dive are some of the key items that need to stressed.
There's far more options to cock something up with a rebreather than with OC. Plenty of 'diligent' people make mistakes.
 
There's far more options to cock something up with a rebreather than with OC. Plenty of 'diligent' people make mistakes.

I understand your point, but it is my contention that if said diligent person had practiced drills and scenarios then the mistake could likely have been averted in the first place. I know we are human and thus mistakes are going to happen, God only knows how many times my mistakes should have removed me from the living.

Like Wookie stated previously, it would have still been the fault of the diver and NOT the rebreather.

I know this thread is opening a can of worms on the subject, just like the threads on RBW, CCRX, etc. in the past and arguing will never change the opinion of others. It is good to get all opinions and facts out there for others to begin sorting through. Hopefully it will help turn people into "Thinking Divers" rather than just following blindly.
 
I understand your point, but it is my contention that if said diligent person had practiced drills and scenarios then the mistake could likely have been averted in the first place. I know we are human and thus mistakes are going to happen, God only knows how many times my mistakes should have removed me from the living.

Like Wookie stated previously, it would have still been the fault of the diver and NOT the rebreather.

I know this thread is opening a can of worms on the subject, just like the threads on RBW, CCRX, etc. in the past and arguing will never change the opinion of others. It is good to get all opinions and facts out there for others to begin sorting through. Hopefully it will help turn people into "Thinking Divers" rather than just following blindly.
I contend that is *is* the rebreather.

Take a car accident. Nearly always driver error. Tough to get into a car accident without the car (inb4 pedestrians). Same with rebreathers. You can't cock up a RB if you aren't diving one to begin with.
 
I contend that is *is* the rebreather.

Take a car accident. Nearly always driver error. Tough to get into a car accident without the car (inb4 pedestrians). Same with rebreathers. You can't cock up a RB if you aren't diving one to begin with.

Are you trying to say that it is not possible to cock up OC and die? Being underwater in the first place puts a diver at a certain level of risk regardless of the equipment.
 
Are you trying to say that it is not possible to cock up OC and die? Being underwater in the first place puts a diver at a certain level of risk regardless of the equipment.
Of course it is. Obvi. But there's more variables with a RB. Variables that don't even exist with OC.
 
Of course it is. Obvi. But there's more variables with a RB. Variables that don't even exist with OC.

But there are far more recovery options on a rebreather. For example, I can have my diluent 1st stage explode, and still complete the dive.
 
But there are far more recovery options on a rebreather. For example, I can have my diluent 1st stage explode, and still complete the dive.
Recovery from system failures that don't even exist on oc isn't a great selling point imo.
 
Depends I have had a regulator fail at 100ft, air stopped flowing. That tank was lost, I had another tank and was able to breath off of it, but due to a faulty second stage I could receive no air from that tank and my dive is significantly shorter. Say I had an complete failure in my O2 reg where no gas would flow from that. I can still breath off my dil and I have hoses on my bail out. I still have working scrubbers so though I will still have to abort a dive I still have the same amount of time to deal with getting out of an overhead environment, deco, and what ever else I need. Now back to the diligent diver when the 2nd stage failed it was very apparent, breath in and nothing comes out. An O2 failure requires the rebreather diver to watch his PPO2 to see there is a problem. Rebreathers do add complexity to a dive, but they do give more options as well. It is about mitigating what the risks are that pose the biggest problems. If I am only going 70 or 80 feet for an hour a rebreather may not be the best tool, I am adding complexity to a dive that does not require it. If I am doing a 200ft trimix dive to penetrate a large ship to get to a specific room something like a 2nd stage reg failure would be a much bigger problem open circuit than on a rebreather. In that example if the rebreather completely fails then I am still an open circuit diver. Still a problem on a rebreather will sneak up on you and catch you off guard if you are careless or not diligent.
 

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