Looking for a durable, competent and affordable can light

[Freshie1234]

If you are thinking about Cave and Technical diving, it will cost you many (MANY!) times more to just get the training (and other gear) to be able to do those dives. Buying a cheaper canister light, and then later upgrading is just water under the bridge. I personally had too much gear to buy when I was shopping for a canister light to really go all out. I agree that with items like wings and regulators you should only buy once and buy right (that doesn't mean new, it just means good quality). However, canister lights have a moderate resale value. Especially trendy ones. So I bought a cheaper canister light and diverted funds to my wings/regs fund. For what its worth, the DRIS canister light is a pretty mid-grade LED canister light, and will serve you just fine. (not advertising for anyone! do your own research) Alternatively, you could go buy a Light monkey 9w or 12w (which costs more). Or a 10w (bulbs are scarce). Or a Dive Gear Express LED canister light. If you had the money to spend, I suppose it would make the most sense to just buy a good 21W canister light (500-750$ range for a nice quality used one). There are many misconceptions about the gear you need and the gear people use. For example, I really wish someone had told me that I could just use a simple, effective, and bulletproof bottom timer from Uwatec ( also rebranded as Scuba Pro and OMS)... you don't really need the more advanced features of a XEN or Petrel until you are doing more "big" dives (in which case you would still have the uwatec as a backup)...

 

[victorzamora]

No dog in this fight other than to counter your assertions that cost is a primary driver of light technology consideration. Perhaps being defensive isn't the best way to bring people to your side of the equation. Do what LM/Salvo did and let your product & service speak for itself.

Certainly not trying to defend Bobby, but I didn't read anything in his post asserting cost as a primary driver of light technology. The Cost per Lumun-hour is actually hugely helpful to me. It showed me I didn't buy the most cost-effective of his lights .

As far as his product and service speaking for itself, they truly do for any who have any interest in listening. I've had two short conversations with Bobby, and his passion for cave diving was clear. His passion for his lights is also obvious, as that company started from him making DIY lights and people demanding them from him. It wasn't a money-making endeavor, and Bobby goes WELL above and beyond for not just customers, but cave divers in general. I've seen Bobby take time out of his own day to fix a non-UWLD product he had no hand in and got no money from. Lucca shot off a very inflammatory remark with absolutely zero experience and clearly very little research. I'm glad Bobby had a chance to at least to correct Lucca's very innaccurate accusations, because Lucca almost had me searching to verify his statements. Bobby saved me a bunch of research. He didn't (and doesn't) talk down about any other product or try to sell his....he re-posted something as a potential tool in choosing a new light.

 

[lucca brassi]

Lucca shot off a very inflammatory remark with absolutely zero experience and clearly very little research. I'm glad Bobby had a chance to at least to correct Lucca's very innaccurate accusations, because Lucca almost had me searching to verify his statements. Bobby saved me a bunch of research. He didn't (and doesn't) talk down about any other product or try to sell his....he re-posted something as a potential tool in choosing a new light.

please explain



if not abused http://www.ledsmagazine.com/articles/2005/05/metrics-for-solid-state-lighting.html

 

[victorzamora]

Your post (Post #18 in this thread) was inflammatory, accusing Bobby's numbers of being misleading and using manipulative values to farther his products in comparison to others. Those are very inflammatory (accusatory, provocative, etc) words to be using in that they imply very harsh things in what you mean. Bobby's numbers have always been conservative, and he's manipulating nothing. He explained all of this. I'm glad he had a chance to explain it and defend himself from such an aggressively-worded post.

Some of the "innacurate accusations" you made were that his emitters, drivers, optics, and batteries are all off-the-shelf units. They are not. Bobby clarified this. I thought your statements were incorrect, and was about to look them up myself when Bobby responded. There were others, but that's the best example.

As to the part about Bobby not talking bad about other products, that seems very obvious and unambiguous. The part about him posting a potential tool in choosing a new light, his Cost per Lumen-hour is an incredibly useful metric.....as long as light manufacturers provide accurate numbers for their lights. We ALL know this isn't the case, however. For example, chinese lights with XM-L emitters claim 1800lm. This is simply not so, they're around 1000lm at best. Other big-name manufacturers also post numbers that are too high, both in terms of burn time and in terms of lumen output. Bobby's numbers are lower than actual. Assuming that we could get accurate numbers, we could compare lights with one very comparable metric as a factor in our decision.

I honestly don't know how I can make the blurb you quoted of me any more clear.

 

[lucca brassi]

@ victorzamora


From the point of view of the customer :


As a possible buyer of light I want for my money as much as can I get . ( true or not? )

Does exist about subject any verification that data from web site are true ( true or not?)

Who stands for the certificate and who verifies certificate?

What information do I have at the moment about this product available? (some Wh , some lumens @ PWM , some power evaluation )

UWLD highlighted in the first place and how to talk with their lights ...... good efficiency in lm / $ ...... based on what?

This is the essence of my questions based on what? ........need more data and it is also exposed to 18 # post

And some really do test to their lights .... I know that tests are not cheap but it's not my problem ... product are not mine and I do not advertise

their effectiveness.

OceanLED - General Underwater Lighting FAQs

Underwater Light Side-by-Side Comparisons

http://www.deepsea.com/wp-content/uploads/tl-Light_Output_SLS_6100.pdf

tauchfunzel.de

As for me I'm not hostile but if somebody account balance in two decimals based on assumptions should also say something about them or have

someone confirm with numbers.

I do not express an allegation, but expressed doubts and there's a difference . Statement is expressed from UWLD in #17

to translate to a more populist way:


Data from datasheets of individual parts lights , do not guarantee that be composed and incorporated into the final product to operate in

conditions such as lab at the factory at optimal conditions. (in that case i see and compare spec from UWLD product site )
Similarly, no power gasoline engine itself made and tested ​​in the factory rack and then built-in motor in the car , with transmission power , exhaust

would not be equal at the test on Testing rollers for torque (this is apparently not?)


From a similar system could conclude that the lumens on emitter at the factory test rack are not the same lumen of light under water are same ;

even DIY we sometimes increase the power through the factory specifications , thats, why test is needed.

With that post I'm out of that theme I don't want to argue but i have but I'm just expressing my opinion in good or bad !

 

[lucca brassi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDjc6cEKqow some video which shows what i have talk about

 

[Bobby]

Lucca,
It would be great to have a sphere to get exact numbers. At minimum it is a $20K investment for a unit that would not be optimal however would do the basics. To really be able have the accuracy and be able to test a wide range of lamps it is close to a 50K investment. The yachting light industry which is much larger and has large margins can afford this type of investment. A small company like ours in a smaller industry like technical dive lights simply can't justify that type of expense. Considering that none of the other manufacturers in our industry have made this investment it just does not make practical sense.

We were one of the first to make a point about Lumen being the correct way to describe light output. Most manufacturers used watts in the past which relates to light output in no way. We invested the time, money, and energy to make a comparison video in real world conditions of our lights and other manufacturers for people to use as a reference. It is on our website on the comparison page.


Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk

 

[lucca brassi]

just for fun .... get on my work post by LED Magazine ( i dont find price ) but is interesting measuring system

Light Measurement | LightSpion | Viso Systems

 

[lucca brassi]

for those shepherds ;-)

from viel viel licht what mean more close to ''real data'' and why I tell ''it must be measured'' instead of blinded trust.

ratio input/output is almost 40% of losses