Scuba diver dies after being found floating at Kurnell, NSW, Australia

[buddhasummer]

You can lead dives 2, 3, and 4. Next time talk to the Instructor and you take the lead. He follows behind, around, etc. and can evaluate the students that way.

Cheers, will do...

 

[gypsyjim]

Thank You & Clownfishsydney & Denis Sydney & all other posts that have given us details on this terrible incident.

Reading this thread, different songs have popped in my mind - from "Puff the Magic Dragon" by Peter, Paul & Mary

to "Roll Me Up & Smoke Me When I Die" by Willie Nelson. However, I am sure there are more appropriate songs to immoratalize Quero.

"Ripple"

If my words did glow with the gold of sunshine
And my tunes were played on the harp unstrung,
Would you hear my voice come thru the music,
Would you hold it near as it were your own?

It's a hand-me-down, the thoughts are broken,
Perhaps they're better left unsung.
I don't know, don't really care
Let there be songs to fill the air.

Ripple in still water,
When there is no pebble tossed,
Nor wind to blow.

Reach out your hand if your cup be empty,
If your cup is full may it be again,
Let it be known there is a fountain,
That was not made by the hands of men.

There is a road, no simple highway,
Between the dawn and the dark of night,
And if you go no one may follow,
That path is for your steps alone.

Ripple in still water,
When there is no pebble tossed,
Nor wind to blow.

But if you fall you fall alone,
If you should stand then who's to guide you?
If I knew the way I would take you home.




http://youtu.be/671AgW9xSiA

 

[Diver0001]

This whole sad situation had certainly made me think very long and hard about the way I dive and how my group as a whole dives. Upon reflection I realise I/we need to make some changes. This weekend is our last wet dive of the season together so will discuss things with my group. It will be a sad dive under the circumstances but a wholly necessary one. I just wish the catalyst was a different one.

I've been having similar thoughts.

It's hard to stay tight. That's one of the big dangers in this sport and nobody is immune to it. This accident just goes to show that a huge incident pit can be built up out of a lot of little things.... little things that you're more likely to let slide when you know your buddies are solid.

R..

 

[S_Brown]

....... I still feel prepared to deal with most any situation at that depth other than entanglement or medical catastrophe. There is still much I don't know about what I don't know.

One of the unfortunate things that I've had to learn the hard way while diving is that no one really knows how they will handle a given situation until they are put into that situation in a very real way. Yes, training helps, and practicing skills helps, but I have found that your basic mindset (for lack of a better term) is going to dictate how well you react when your life is REALLY on the line. Some people can remain calm and rational during times of high stress and some people have lower tolerances for stress before panic sets in. I don't know how to explain it very well, I guess. Sometimes training and practiced skills aren't enough. Sometimes you need a little more. You never know if you really have what it takes, until you're there.

Hopefully, with the proper planning, well-maintained equipment and a little situational awareness, most of us never have to find out what we are made of.

 

[Slamfire]

I finally got to the end of the thread. Throughout all the posts I read, I saw the topic of a panic-less death very sparsely and lightly touched upon. I got the impression that most participants think that a mind clouded by despair and panic explains this incident better. I would like to expand a little further on a panic-less alternative.

I think that we can establish that when an experienced tank-less spearo or a free diver suffers from shallow water blackouts panic is usually not present. We condition and train ourselves to ignore the burning feeling screaming at you to take a breath to the point of hypoxic blackouts. When I was very young (13?) I damaged my inner ear equilibrium by doing underwater laps in a pool that was no more than 8 ft deep. While in the water I was never scared or fearful. I just remember pushing myself further and further. I did get scared when my Dr. told me that this happened because I was holding my breath too long while exerting myself. I got scared because I had been able to cancel out my natural anti-drowning alarms and after doing this, drowning could creep upon me without warning. Since then I try to not push myself on breath holds.

This is how I envision Quero's final moments:

She went down to 8 or 10 ft to go back to shore. She found a leafy seahorse and started taking pictures. What could go wrong? She's done 1000s of dives and if you get in trouble during this final submersion you're so shallow that you practically just stand up. You feel that it's getting harder to take a breath from the reg, but after some struggle against a tight undersized drysuit and a bulky undergarment you managed to get your spg and see that it says you still have gas. You think that maybe somehow your tank valve might have rolled partially closed.

In any case you decide it's time to go up. You inflate your bcd and hear some bubbling out the opv but you're still negative. Now you remember the drysuit and try to go for it, but again you hear bubbling out of the exhaust valve. Breathing keeps getting harder, so you start breath skipping and breath holding longer in order to extend your gas until you sort out all these nuisances and get back to the surface comfortably positive. You try to secure your expensive monster camera rig in such a way that you leave enough mobility for your right arm to reach the dump valve to close it. You spend longer than expected doing this.

Crap, now you can't suck out any gas from the regulator, but you've managed to reach the dump valve. Then you realize that without gas getting to your low pressure ports the suit will not inflate. SPG says you have some gas in the tank so you move your attention to trying fully open that tank valve that must be semi-closed... After a few seconds you realize that if the tank valve is semi-closed, spg should have been moving visibly down when you suck air and slowly recuperate back up. This means spg is wrong and now you're out of air and negative.

This is annoying, now you'll have to dump weights and swim back over here to recover them later. By now you've been holding your breath for quite a while. So with your limited mobility and with your camera getting in the way you struggle to get to the dumpable weights to find out that they seem to be stuck and not cooperating to be released. You keep fighting the weights until an unexpected blackout happens.​

I didn't know Quero personally, but we did have some discussions around here (the latest of them on opposing sides). I prefer to imagine her last moments fighting adversity with a minimum amount of mental anguish. To me, she went out fighting not cowering in a haze of fear and panic.

I would like to think we can make panic a choice. I would like to think that if I get hopelessly trapped I can consciously and wilfully hold my breath until I pass out. We all die. We don't always get to choose when, but we can choose how. I would like to choose a death without panic.

 

[jkaterenchuk]

I would like to expand a little further on a panic-less alternative.

In any case you decide it's time to go up. You inflate your bcd and hear some bubbling out the opv but you're still negative. ​

​

And now that the BCD is full you have several good breaths of air to use. I guess someone in panic might not consider that option like an experiences and calm instructor might.

 

[DandyDon]

If this is accurate, then the dive plan lacked proper components, including "whom was diving with whom"....

Based on that, and pure speculation, with no intent to lay blame:

Thats Pre-dive 101 if there is more than two people.... seems overconfidence (perhaps by all, or by one independent) contributed to this.

assumptions, left unstated, are not a good plan.

You'll see that a lot if you travel and dive with various groups. Be prepared.

I tend to view any diver with a camera as a solo diver who will want to get away from the group at that, including myself. I try to make sure my pony is ready for use and not get myself into problems I can't save myself from - and I can be creative with my screwups.

If I do buddy with another, I do work at watching him/her closely - but ask that s/he make sure to stick with me if needed, chew me out on the boat later if desired, but stay close to me and my pony. And I hate buddy trios! I might agree to watch one, but not two - and I never know if either of the other two are watching me or each other, but then I just try to watch myself, regardless.

You cannot help those who do not want help.

I will note that in a number of Quero's posts there were comments about as a female not be given appropriate respect for her diving skills. The feeling of a need to prove yourself or be independent is often good but can lead to ignoring advice especially if outside your skill set.

I am hesitant to question or impose my opinions on others. I am certainly no shining example of how diving should be done, so I just try to watch myself and be ready for whatever a new buddy might need - and it didn't take me many trips & instant buds to give up and buy a pony. I do ask how to remove a bud's weights if it's not obvious, but not much more than my "We stay together, all the way" talk. My home bud gets harder treatment from me, I don't mind upsetting him, and I have a standing promise to his mom - but he seems to have quit diving really.

If I was diving with a professional, I'd totally expect him/her to be self sufficient have be well organized - especially in 10 ft deep water.

To me this is the biggest take away from this accident. I think that it is very natural and common for divers (myself included) to significantly lower their guard at that stage of the dive, thinking that it is basically over. This is particularly the case where surface conditions are benign and depth is very shallow as was the case here.

It reminds me of the often quoted stats about high percentage of car crashes taking place near the driver's home.

Yep, except for the car part. Most wrecks happen close to home because most driving is done close to home, aside from professional cross country drivers who generally are more cautious - but exploring vacationers are the worst.

 

[Diver0001]

[/INDENT]

And now that the BCD is full you have several good breaths of air to use. I guess someone in panic might not consider that option like an experiences and calm instructor might.

Yeah, the thought crossed my mind too that breathing the BCD would have bought enough time to drop the weights.

It still puzzles me greatly that she didn't drop the weights.

R..

 

[S_Brown]

If you've never run out of air underwater, you may not understand what it actually feels like. I have, and for me it was nothing like slamfire describes. No disrespect meant.

 

[redacted]

If you've never run out of air underwater, you may not understand what it actually feels like. I have, and for me it was nothing like slamfire describes. No disrespect meant.

So what was your response? Are you assuming that all people would respond as you did?

I have never accidentally run out of air on scuba. But I have managed to get entangled a couple times while free diving. I assessed the situation and worked my way free.