Sad News

[Scubaroo]

Scubaboard is hardly the hub of online rebreather discussions - we tend to only hear the negatives on here. Tens if not hundreds of thousands of successful Inspiration dives are being done each year by Inspiration RB divers - according to madmole's website, there were about 5000 Inspirations in 2002 - who knows how many have been sold since then. Remember as well that many of the dives being done with these machines are usually deep or long exposures that would push the limits of OC, so naturally there is a higher risk involved. Anti-RB detractors make sure that everyone hears how "dangerous" these devices are however.

My condolences to Luca's family and friends, any diving fatality is a tragedy.

 

[madmole]

I cant say much as its not public knowledge and I promised some sources not to tell yet. But in this case this appears almost not to be an Inspiration incident

If what I hearing from several sources is true then this wont be going on the Inspiration fatality list, except as a cautionary tale

What it is however, is a tragedy and my condolences go out to all involved. I feel guilty as I am one of the people who Luca chated with when making the descision to dive a RB and we become MSN Messenger buddies and chated often. I am very suprised at what has apparently taken place as "Bombarolo" always struck me as a very sane and informed diver ideally sorted to using a rebreather. His icon on my messenger window has been haunting me all weekend and removing it yesterday was very difficult. It seemed kind of final, as if all the while it was there there was some hope

The real fact of this whole sorry mess is that solo diving has claimed yet another diver. It was a shallow simple dive by an experianced diver with over 200 hours on a rebreather. Take note, unlike OC where you know there is a problem, on ANY RB you may go unconciouse before you even know something is wrong or can action it. In this case a buddy is your ONLY chance. Please, please, please do really consider your actions if you do solo a RB

There are definately lessons to be learnt from this case. What is suprising and annoying is that they appear to be ones we already are well aware of. This is what makes this sad occasion even more frustrating and depressing

 

[Mverick]

:frown2: No. Lots and lots of Inspirations are dived every day without incident. You could equally well argue it's another solo death. Or another technical diving death on a deep dive. Etc.

I'm very sad to hear of Luca's death in any case. My thoughts are with his family and friends. :frown2:

Well, actually.

You can't equally well argue it's another Technical diving death. It was 60feet for 60 min. Not really a technical dive. From the information posted.

And You can't equally well argue it's another Death on a deep dive. Because it was 60feet.

You can argue it was another solo death. But to be honest. Only ones of those I've ever heard are on Rebreathers. And at 60ft and 60min. I could have swam it up. If I had a failure at that depth. On OC.

RB's do demand your complete attention. Get complacent. And stuff happens.

Condolences to the family. Loss is always tragic.

 

[BigJetDriver]

(1) You can argue it was another solo death. But to be honest. Only ones of those I've ever heard are on Rebreathers. And at 60ft and 60min. I could have swam (sic) it up. If I had a failure at that depth. On OC.

(2) RB's do demand your complete attention. Get complacent. And stuff happens.

(1) The "ONLY" solo fatal accidents that you have heard about in scuba diving have been with rebreathers??? Are you not a DAN member? Do you not read DAN's summaries of diving accidents world-wide? It makes sobering reading. I would suggest you retract your previous statement, and obtain a copy of the latest summary.

(2) You are quite correct about the second statement. Checklists, proper procedure, and constant awareness ARE the stuff of life with these units! They are NOT for your average or casual diver. This is not snobbery, it is reality.

BJD

 

[Mverick]

(1) The "ONLY" solo fatal accidents that you have heard about in scuba diving have been with rebreathers??? Are you not a DAN member? Do you not read DAN's summaries of diving accidents world-wide? It makes sobering reading. I would suggest you retract your previous statement, and obtain a copy of the latest summary.

(2) You are quite correct about the second statement. Checklists, proper procedure, and constant awareness ARE the stuff of life with these units! They are NOT for your average or casual diver. This is not snobbery, it is reality.

BJD

Actually, I'm quite correct about all 4 statements.

The "Only" solo deaths I've heard of are on RB's. Sorry, but that's Quite correct. They are the only ones.

Yep, DAN Member. It's required.

I've heard of guy's dying that were by themselves. Basicly, buddy wasn't doing there job.

Like the guy with duals who went off the boat. Hadn't filled his BC. And hadn't turned his tanks on. They found him drowned on the bottom. But, he was off a boat with plenty of people. And had a buddy. Girl found with a current hook. Mask blown off from current and dead. Yet she had a buddy too. Current was to swift to get to her. There are more deaths I hear of on OC. But, They all have buddies it seems. Girl shoots to the surface holds her breath. From 60ft. Dead. But had a buddy. Saw her face. 3 kids. Around 25. Husband was her buddy. Audre doing record Freediving. But she had 6-8 divers as backup. Still dead. But I don't consider that Solo.

To me, Solo is. Grab your gear. Go to the lake. And dive. With nobody. That's solo.

I'm sure it's happened. But I haven't heard of one.

 

[fins wake]

You can't equally well argue it's another Technical diving death. It was 60feet for 60 min. Not really a technical dive. From the information posted.And You can't equally well argue it's another Death on a deep dive. Because it was 60feet.

You're absolutely right, and I'm wrong. I misread the initial statements as 60 m(etres), not 60 minutes.

You can argue it was another solo death. But to be honest. Only ones of those I've ever heard are on Rebreathers. And at 60ft and 60min. I could have swam it up. If I had a failure at that depth. On OC.

Yes, it certainly appears to be a solo death, which in the RB case is way overrepresented. And you're right about swimming up on OC. As you yourself state:

RB's do demand your complete attention. Get complacent. And stuff happens.

Precisely. Agree entirely.

 

[fins wake]

The "Only" solo deaths I've heard of are on RB's. Sorry, but that's Quite correct. They are the only ones. [...] To me, Solo is. Grab your gear. Go to the lake. And dive. With nobody. That's solo.I'm sure it's happened. But I haven't heard of one.

They do in fact happen all the time. I know of several such incidents. Off the top of my head, one in Gothenburg three years ago (the guy died in less than 5 metres of water if I recall correctly ...) and one in a wreck off Stockholm some two years ago (at relatively shallow depth, some 20-25 metres). Both very much on OC. That's just local, and without digging into any archives.

Of course, "ordinary" recreational diving deaths on OC, whether single or buddied, whether in Sweden, Egypt, Fiji or the UK, usually don't make it onto international scuba fora, and in any case don't usually generate the interest of recreational or technical RB deaths.

This is not a problem for RB diving per se, provided it serves as a salutory warning on complacency, discipline etc to other RB divers.

I hope the French Navy lab findings are released in full once investigation is completed, and also that Madmole is able to release information, so that we can all learn from this tragic accident. I'm pretty sure that would have been Luca's last wish.

 

[db8us]

Any news about the dead ANDI-IT with his rebreather in Subic-bay from this week ?
Let me guess.... heart-attack ?

 

[BigJetDriver]

I've heard of guy's dying that were by themselves. Basicly, buddy wasn't doing there (sic) job.

Like the guy with duals who went off the boat. Hadn't filled his BC. And hadn't turned his tanks on. They found him drowned on the bottom. But, he was off a boat with plenty of people. And had a buddy. Girl found with a current hook. Mask blown off from current and dead. Yet she had a buddy too. Current was to swift to get to her. There are more deaths I hear of on OC. But, They all have buddies it seems. Girl shoots to the surface holds her breath. From 60ft. Dead. But had a buddy. Saw her face. 3 kids. Around 25. Husband was her buddy. Audre doing record Freediving. But she had 6-8 divers as backup. Still dead. But I don't consider that Solo.

I'm sorry. I guess you are correct, since obviously your definition of "buddy diving" is the infamous: "Same Ocean, Same Day" definition!

Since you say you are a DAN member, you need to read, or re-read, the report on accident statistics. The facts simply do not back up what you are trying to allege.

BJD

 

[fins wake]

Let me guess.... heart-attack ?

You appear to be right about the diagnosis. Which incidentally came very quickly, after an autopsy the very same evening, I believe. Equipment and gas were apparently in order. So clearly medical examiners and accident analysts in Subic Bay work very efficiently ...

Although I understand Michael's cynicism, it cannot of course be precluded that the victim actually did have a massive heart attack as stated.

And although I haven't yet seen specified which brand of rebreather was involved, I surmise that it very likely is a well-known German constant mass flow RB. That doesn't in itself make this particular brand 'dangerous' of course.

Again, this death is very tragic as most deaths are. And once again, one should be very careful when diving any rebreather. But theoretically, we don't know enough about this 54-metre dive to categorically state it couldn't have happened on OC ...