rebreather death edo-04 (rb 80 clone)

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db8us once bubbled...
If i am shallow or near the surface, i do not need a breather.
I only use it if it´s advantages outweighs the disadvantages.

Here in a local lake (20m depth) i often see divers doing 40Minutes with an YBOD or Draeger...
I prefer OC then...

I've done 10m shore dives on my Inspiration and couldn't think of switching back to OC. To hang just above the grasses at 6m with perfect buoyancy, breathing warm/moist air and just watch the fish swim around, fish eating fish and they get really close without them damn bubbles.

While I did buy the Inspiration for deeper dives (which are fun too :) ), nothing wrong with a nice shallow dive on a CCR. As per DIR, diving the same equipment is goodness.
 
db8us once bubbled...
If i am shallow or near the surface, i do not need a breather.
I only use it if it´s advantages outweighs the disadvantages.
How deep do you go before switching to your RB? Or do you start the dive semi-closed and just end it open, blow what's left once you know you won't need it?
db8us once bubbled...
Here in a local lake (20m depth) i often see divers doing 40Minutes with an YBOD or Draeger...
The Dräger is sort of made for those kinds of dives. The ones you're doing on your RB80 and lots of CCR divers do shouldn't or couldn't be done with a Ray or Dolphin. As for the duration at that depth, could be mix (on SCR), boredom or stamina. Not everyone is in, and into, top shape.
However, to stay proficient at diving, especially CCR diving, you have to practice. I've seen people do the same with double 12s and stage in quarries. Invites ridicule, but you gotta keep practicing somewhere.
db8us once bubbled...
During exploration dives i think one is not able to constantly check "displays" and i can not hear the Oxygauge-Alarm ;-(
On an RMV-SCR you shouldn't have to do it constantly. However I'm sure you could master the task of checking if you felt the need to do so. As for the Oxygauge, as well as the previously mentioned odd values, it's only one sensor. A tripple display with as many sensors it the way to go ... .

madmole once bubbled...

Youre the 4th or 5th RB-80 user I've talked to who finds that their unit is not suitable for shallow water use, is this a design fault or a user problem?
We talked about that before. The RB80 was developed for deep cave penetration, DIR style. For that it works, obviously, rather well. That doesn't in any way mean the rig can do anything that coudn't be done with a CCR. The butt-level bellows works well when horizontal, which is where they spend most of their time. If it works for them, it works for them. Doesn't mean it works for you and me. As JJ said in a thread (bouyancy section)
Jarrod once bubbled...

GUE was never about training for all divers any more than Halcyon strives to be about equipment for everyone.
The RB80 is Halcyon gear.
madmole once bubbled...

Just consider yourself a Mac user when the rest of the world are using PC's
That's not nice, Mole. I AM a Mac user, and I rather dive CCRs than SCRs. :rolleyes:
KentCe once bubbled...
As per DIR, diving the same equipment is goodness.
They were talking about the same equipment and configurations for similar kind of dives and among team members. Do you really think that every DIR-caver hauls twins, stages, scooters, reels, lights and if, they use one, an RB80 or two on every dive they do?:confused:
Add-ited: Also, DIR means not to take anything you don't need, which I'm sure has a highter priority than taking everything you need on your most challenging dive everytime you go for equipment-sameness sake.
Besides, when using any RB other than the 80 you're already doing it all wrong. Might as well enjoy the shallow dives with your CCR. :D
(End of Edit)

The RB80 seems to do what is was designed for rather well, judging by the dives done in FL and Europe. But it has limits and negative points just as any other piece of equipment. May that be price, availability, breathing comfort, size, lack of decompression advantage. If any or all are important, use something else. Whatever else it is, I'm sure it comes with plenty of disadvantages, too.
 
madmole once bubbled...
Youre the 4th or 5th RB-80 user I've talked to who finds that their unit is not suitable for shallow water use, is this a design fault or a user problem?

It would not say "unsuitable", just "unnecessary".
I would not bother filling it, etc, since you have to be as anal with pre-dive checks etc as doing a big dive.


As for not being able to flip up a handset and check some numbers every minute or so, thats rubbish, course you can do it easily (trained and practiced since dive 1 on the unit). Dont you check your tables, bottom timer, contents guage etc during your dives?. How do you check and listen to the RB-80 to make sure all those valves and injectors are working fine and bubbling when they should then? At least the YBOD, HH etc shout/flash/Shake loudly if your a complete prat and miss the obvious.
Of course i COULD check them every Minute, but this would take attention away from the cave, buddy, etc and i do not want to stop scootering, so i decide not to check it !

Dont get me wrong I like the RB-80 and think its a good unit. But its not the ONLY unit and its certainly not the most suitable unit for the way most folks dive. If its the tool that you choose to use thats fine, but consider that not everyone dives the same as you and that cost and availablity are also important factors in the choice of unit. Just consider yourself a Mac user when the rest of the world are using PC's
I totally agree on that one. I use the RB80 for cave-exploration and for some deeper lake-dives and i a usually do not fight against other units, since i do not have experience (enough) with them.
I just wanted to point out, that saving money and going for a cheap-bad-copy might kill you and this is what this thread is about.
e.g. i said on exploration dives i would not use an Oxygauge, but I COULD, because the port is there (and on the first 4-5 exploration dives we had it in)
On the EDO, they even saved the money for the port to plug it in.

Michael
 
@Anthony:
about the price: It is not cheap i agree, but the swiss tried to make one cheaper and so they took cheap materials instead of Teflon-coated alumnium, Stainless steel, Darling-hoses, spring-loaded scrubber.
They even saved the Oxygauge-port and an Overpressure-valve on the switchblock. This is stupidity, i totally agree with you !

@caveseeker:
about the training, i agree, but we quiet often do longer cave-dives and so we stay "sharp". Also we use it sometimes shallow for breather-workshops.
We require our team-members to be "retrained" every year, of course thats for free, since we are not commercially interested.

About the checking and hearing:
You hear the gas venting from the breather and after every 2-3 normal breaths or every deep one you hear the hissing of the gas injecting. The more Helium and the deeper you are the better it is.
I have no clue if you would hear it on an EDO04, cause the injectors are sitting in plastic, which does not transmit the sound to good.
By they way, the amount of force need to trigger the EDO is 3 times the force that i need on my unit !

If the EDO would have been a working copy without design flaws i would have no problem admitting it is DIR !
But never we would compromise safety against saving money.

Again: I only speak for myself and dives of our group.
If one wants to do shallow stuff on the breather because it feels good i can understand it. But i would rarely do it.
I did some shallow dives on military oxygen-rebreathers, etc, but i still would prefer OC for the "let´s jump in"-dives.
 
db8us once bubbled...
But never we would compromise safety against saving money.

People make that statement, but its always false. We always make safety trade offs to save money. Even NASA. Even airlines. Even when we buy cars. Welcome to the real world.

The key term is "compromise safety". Very subjective. To some not having a deco chamber on the boat would "compromise safety". (How many lifes could of been saved if every dive boat had a deep diving deco chamber on it?). To others, saving money not buying a second dive computer would compromise safety. Then down to the simple metal vs plastic for clips.

Life is more about managing risks within our incomes range.
 
@KentCe
OK, you are right, but would you buy a car without airbags and buckles and safe let´s say 500Dollar on a 30.000 Dollar car ?

If we we would talk about either 100 or 10000000000 i would agree.
But of course this is also up to everyone.

It is like the redundancy question.... This guy was diving solo, but with a double-rebreather.....
Where was the redundancy of a divepartner who could have just stand him up ? He drowned in 6feet.....

I think we could argue for weeks....
At least there will be a complete report i heard...
 
Se7en once bubbled...
Hang on... don't you drive an elise?
You might not be Driving It RIGHT, but you sure are DRIVING It Right. :D

Here some adjusted tips (from a previous post) to make your car fit your diving: Halcyon hose covers in the engine room, Jet Fin mud flaps, throw out the seat backs and replace with Halcyon bp & harness (now no airbag needed anymore, but if you want to install one make sure it's a bellow, not a bag!), nitrousoxide tank with quick connect mounted on one side, a fire extinguisher on the other. :D
 
caveseeker7 once bubbled...
[B
You might not be Driving It RIGHT, but you sure are DRIVING It Right. :D

Here some adjusted tips (from a previous post) to make your car fit your diving: Halcyon hose covers in the engine room, Jet Fin mud flaps, throw out the seat backs and replace with Halcyon bp & harness (now no airbag needed anymore, but if you want to install one make sure it's a bellow, not a bag!), nitrousoxide tank with quick connect mounted on one side, a fire extinguisher on the other. :D [/B]

LOL ... anyone not driving using the aforementioned configuration are "strokes" and will surely die soon!
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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