SMB Questions

[mwalsh787]

Hello All,

I am interested in getting an SMB and had a few questions. Any help would be appreciated

Should one have a line and reel with an SMB? If so, what length line? Is a "finger reel" the right type of reel?

What's the best place to get some training on the use of an SMB?

Mike

 

[KY]

Q 1- Reel or Spool - Google search that question. Some people swear by Kent toolings reels, others (notably those hearding from the US), swear by a spool. If you're going for a spool, google Halcyon cold water spool, its the only spool out there that is actually any good. As for DSMB, the BEST in the market by a BIG margin, is the AP Valves DSMB's.

Q 2 - The only people who teach DSMB are the European agencies, ie the BSAC, CMAS etc of this world. All others, just really dont bother, or tell you to buy a spool, while pulling you towards their shop walls, and highlighting the spools they have on the wall, which are all really nice, and are the best available, all discounted for club members..... Gets them out of really having to spend the time teaching anyone how to put up a blob properly.

Once you've got whatever, just sit under a pier, tie a knot in the blob, and just keep practicing...

 

[scubadiver888]

What you should get depends on what you want to do with it. If it is just for signalling on the surface, you will not need a reel. If you want to use it during a safety stop and your safety stops will be at 15 feet, then a small finger spool would be sufficient.

On the other hand, you might want a finger spool with 150 feet of line. For example, you arrive at the GPS coordinates for a wreck but there is no buoy. You free descent to the wreck, shoot the SMB from the wreck, boat captain detaches the SMB and ties a buoy line to the finger spool. You pull the buoy line down to the wreck and tie off. Now everyone else can use the buoy line to find the wreck. I suggest 150 feet because I'm assuming you are a recreational diver and won't go beyond 140 feet.

Any good dive shop should be able to show you how to use an SMB. You might also want to ask them what you should get based on the training they give you and the local diving environment. The PADI Search and Recovery Adventure Dive should teach you the basic of using an SMB.

 

[String]

Hello All,

I am interested in getting an SMB and had a few questions. Any help would be appreciated

Should one have a line and reel with an SMB? If so, what length line? Is a "finger reel" the right type of reel?[

Reel or spool. Both will work. Personal preference.

Line length depends on how deep you intend on sending it up from. I have 40m on mine.

What's the best place to get some training on the use of an SMB?

Mike

A diver that knows and users them a lot is fine. You dont NEED to do a course for this really. Just pick someone that knows what they're doing and ask them.

 

[Banyan]

Hello All,

I am interested in getting an SMB and had a few questions. Any help would be appreciated

Should one have a line and reel with an SMB? If so, what length line? Is a "finger reel" the right type of reel?

I always carry a DSMB with me attached to finger reel with 150' line and brass double-ender. If the sausage is going to be used exclusively for inflation and signaling at the surface, you don't need a reel.

However, if you "shoot the bag", as you'll see it referred to, at your safety stop on a boat dive, the boat will often be waiting for you so you don't have to wait around on the surface. Sending the SMB to the surface is also useful in shore dives that get jet ski or other vessel traffic so the first warning about divers in the water that the drivers get isn't your head popping up in front of their boat.

I can think of scenarios where I might find myself at recreational limits and wanting to send up a bag to let the boat know where I am, especially if I'm moving in a current, so I have the 150' line just in case. I've also used my SMB in a pinch as lift bag on cleanup dives when I'm hauling a big bag of aluminum cans and need to get it off the bottom, though of course you don't need a reel for that.

What's the best place to get some training on the use of an SMB?

I actually just watched some how-to videos on YouTube, especially this one, and once I had all my gear did dry runs of the complete procedure. This involved putting on my BC, draping my reg setup over my shoulders with my reg in my mouth while standing in my living room so I could figure out when I needed to switch from my primary reg to my octo, learn that I needed a step to clip my brass double-ender to my BCD, and just generally figure out what hand needed to be doing what when. Once I felt that I had a good grasp on the procedure I jumped into 10 feet of water and did it for real, with the result that I still had too much line out my first try, which somehow got wrapped around my hand when I inflated the sausage and sent me to the surface. And once I could reliably send a sausage up from 10 fsw, I started doing it from deeper and deeper, even sending one up mid-dive and towing it around like a dive flag just to see what sort of task loading is required.

Of course, once I had a decent grasp of the skill, I found others who I probably could have just asked. But one of them clipped his reel to his BCD at his safety stops with the double-ender, and I really don't recommend creating that sort of non-easily releasable connection between you at depth and an buoyant object at the surface.

If your dive group or boat doesn't usually send up SMBs, it would be a good idea to tell them you'll be practicing so they don't worry when they see the bag go up.

----
EDIT: DevonDiver gives an excellent description of the difference between an SMB, DSMB and safety sausage below. Though I use all three terms in my post, I am referring to a DSMB, though the terminology seems a little loose even around ScubaBoard (perhaps because Americans aren't usually taught how to use them and never figure out the proper names ).

 

[Spazzy]

A good SMB is an essential safety tool.

A spool or reel is only necessary if you're going to deploy it underwater. Personally I carry a DSMB and spool on every dive and carry a reel and 2nd yellow DSMB on some deco dives.

Deploying a bag or DSMB underwater is potentially very dangerous - and training from a professional instructor is the way to go. It's very easy to get the line caught around your gear (e.g. the 2nd stage you're using to inflate the bag) and very difficult to deal with that situation successfully under stress unless you're properly trained and practiced. I've seen people mess this up and take a quick trip to the surface - a great way to get seriously bent, an overexpansion injury or a prop chop. Not good.

So get some training from an instructor. Learn to manage loose line, to put a little gas in 1st to get the DSMB erect, to have a line cutter ready-to-go on your finger, and to look up before deploying. Learn how to deploy on your own and with a buddy/team. Your instructor may have you start on land, then deploy your DSMB kneeling on the (shallow) bottom, and then progress to mid-water deployment as your skill and comfort levels increase. And then practice, practice, practice in shallow water before you try to do it in anger. Please don't listen to those who say you can teach yourself these skills - there is no substitute for good instruction and repeated practice.

I know BSAC, TDI and SSI-XR courses teach this skill. Other forum participants can no doubt identify other courses.

If you're in hurry then why not buy a self-sealing DSMB (big is best) with an overpressure valve and a good attachment point for a line. That way you'll have a great SMB for surface use, and can seek instruction about how to deploy it underwater and buy the spool/reel later. Buying a good DSMB is a future-proof purchase that will set you up for DSMB deployment training down the track - and will be useful for a wide range of diving including deco diving.

I hope this is helpful.

 

[DevonDiver]

Should one have a line and reel with an SMB?

An SMB (surface marker buoy) is typically deployed at the start of the dive and 'towed' by the diver during the entire dive. This allows people of the surface (boat captain etc) to track their progress.

In contrast a DSMB (delayed surface marker buoy) is typically deployed at the endof the dive. Before, or during, their ascent to the surface the diver will inflate and deploy the DSMB. This serves the purpose of 'announcing' their ascent, allowing a dive boat to track you and also provides a reference line for you to ascend upon.

The other option is a Safety Sausage. Whilst often confused with DSMBs, these are simple plastic tubes that are inflated on, or near, the surface as a method of signalling.

If so, what length line? Is a "finger reel" the right type of reel?

For DSMB deployment, the line must be sufficient for your deepest diving depth. This will allow you the option of deploying the DSMB at any time during the dive. 30-50m of line is sufficient for most recreational divers.

You may also opt to utilise the reel/line for other purposes - such as for navigation around a dive site, or for wreck penetration. If so, you might want to have more line of the reel than you would for simply doing DSMB deployment. 50-150m of line might be more useful for recreational diving purposes.

Finger Reels are a very popular choice of reel, especially for DSMB deployment. They typically hold 15/20/30/40m of line. This limits their use for navigation and penetration (although they are used by cave diver for short 'jumps' between existing main navigation lines).

Firstly, they are very inexpensive. A finger reel typically costs $15-20. A reliable ratchet reel can cost $150-300.

Secondly, the finger reel is simple and minimalist. It is virtually impossible to tangle and 'birds nest' due to the lack of winding mechanism.

Thirdly, the finger reel deploys DSMBs very quickly and easily, once you have the technique learned.

Lastly, due to the low cost of the Finger Reel, you won't have a wallet crisis should you ever drop it, or make a safety decision to abandon it/let it go.

What's the best place to get some training on the use of an SMB?

An instructor or divemaster who is qualified at 'technical diver' level.

In Europe, DSMB training is often regarded as mandatory. Even PADI have introduced a specialist dedicated training course in it's use (mostly limited to the UK).

In other locations, i.e. the USA, it is a neglected skill. This is wrong.

Deploying a DSMB is a simple process.. but there are dangers (the biggest one is being 'pulled rapidly to the surface' by getting tangled in the DSMB and line). Getting some tuition in this helps mitigate some of the risks. It's quite possible to find a helpful instructor, divemaster or other experienced diver who can give you some directions and assistance with learning these techniques.

You can also look on Youtube... as there are some tuition/skills videos on there...

YouTube - SCUBA: SMB Deployment

YouTube - GUE Fundamentals DSMB Deployment Practice

YouTube - SMB Deployment

 

[k ellis]

Very interesting topic and a great one to be brought up. SMBs seem to be the one under spoken of items I have seen a diver use. It is important to make sure when you purchase one too to make sure its marked for your type of diving youll be expecting to do. As others have mentioned it has several puposes and therefore several diffrent designs.

As others have mentioned you can use it to warn potential boat traffic of a diver preparing to surface. Be sure if this is your intention you get one marked diver below or some other markings. If this is the intent there are ones marked EMERGENCY. This might get you an unwanted surprise when you do surface and some pretty less then happy people there too.

Most people carry the Sausage type simply because it does roll up so compact and is fairly easy to store often times even in a BCDS pocket. though they are extremely easy to use for the most part simple science so they really require no training I would strongly encourage seeking out more experienced people and practice it out as they can become an entanglement hazard.

The finger real is an excellent choice due to economical reasoning as others have stated too.

The Sausage people spoke of previously is perhaps one of the most important post dive gear you should have if diving out in the open seas. Ive used them when surfacing and found out that everyone in cozumel decided to party right where we were surfacing at. I stress the importance of these because in the event even in calm waters that while you are under the surface swells can unexpectedly kick up and on occasion be quiet amazing in height. Should some reason you become seperated from the group and or away from the boat and down current from it. Its much easier to see a fluorecent orange sausage extending upwards to 10 feet or more (They do make some amazingly large ones) Then it is to see ones head with a black hood on extending less then a foot above the water. In my opinion it should be accompanied without exception with a whistle or other audible device.

Lift bags are also great SB substitutes though they are not really designed for this pupose. They usually tend to only rise a small distance out of the water. I would recommend on these once again you get the in flourecent colors just in the advent you do have to use them for emergencies.

What ever you decide its best to sit and think over the most possible uses your going to use it for and then make the decisions on which one to buy.

As others have said I must say it once again though. If you plan to deploy from under the surface Make sure you arent entangled or attached to the smb before deployement This could be a bad situation

 

[TheYellowSubmarine]

Don't deploy SMB on a 100ft spool/reel from 100ft. Any current/movement at all will require more line than the depth you are at. Use a safety factor of 1.5 to 2 times your depth depending on conditions. Failure to do this will result in the spool/reel being pulled out of your hands, or you being pulled up much faster than you should ascend.

If you know what depth you intend on using the spool/reel, this can also help you decide on what size to buy.

 

[DevonDiver]

Don't deploy SMB on a 100ft spool/reel from 100ft. Any current/movement at all will require more line than the depth you are at. Use a safety factor of 1.5 to 2 times your depth depending on conditions. Failure to do this will result in the spool/reel being pulled out of your hands, or you being pulled up much faster than you should ascend.

If you know what depth you intend on using the spool/reel, this can also help you decide on what size to buy.

Whilst it is good advice to not deploy a DSMB from the maximum extremity of the line that you have available... the effect of current is really not that critical.

The line itself is thin... so there isn't much of a drag issue. The DSMB (if fully inflated) will rise quickly...and once at the surface the line should be vertical.

The trick is to be floating freely and neutrally buoyant when you deploy it. The issue of line drag only exists if you are negative on the bottom and not able to drift under the DSMB as it deploys.

When both the DSMB and the diver are floating freely, then any current will affect the diver more (greater water resistance), thus you will 'lead' the DSMB...and notvice versa.